Nato without USA is still bigger military than Russia.
Yep, and thankfully the EU has seen the way the US is going and started to react appropriately.
But with a fraction of the nukes, which is the actual big stick part of NATO
A lot of that is because rest of NATO is under US umbrella. Not like nukes are high tech at this point. Most of Europe could get nukes real fast if they wanted, but everyone has been better served by it being to many Nuclear Powers up to this point
And I expect they will get nukes real fast. Ukraine is probably going to go for that, tbh. It’s kinda their only option at this point.
It took two nukes for Japan to wave the white flag. Do we really need 5,000+ nukes for anything? France has 290 and UK has 225. Thats enough to wipe one or multiple countries clean off of the map without any form of surrender.
Yes, antimissile systems will shoot down most of your missile volley, so you need to launch enough that they become overwhelmed and the few that make it through accomplish your goal.
We don’t know exactly how much “most” is, but its enough that the powers that be consider our current level of armament to be necessary.
This is where I think there is a misunderstanding. You don’t just fire only nukes at a country. You fire a multi pronged attack with regular bombardment aswell.
Shooting down a nuclear icbm doesn’t really help as much as you think, if it catches it.
Not to mention the atmosphere lighting up wouldn’t be much better
You know they don’t go critical when you shoot them right?
Doesn’t that depend on how they’re set up? I’d imagine in the 50+ years since they’ve been invented they would have designed it so it could, specifically because modern anti missile defenses exist.
I mean, I know world governments can be dumb, but I would imagine they’re not that dumb as to bother maintaining a key super weapon just to not upgrade it / design it so that it won’t work if used.
Maybe but no not really the triggering process is extremely fast but kinda fragile because everything needs to be compressed just so.
They upgrade them, it’s public knowledge for the budget. Usually it’s faster smaller or different form factor plus renewal programs.
Will the ones shit down rain down radioactive dust everywhere?
Yes, but to a way lesser degree.
The bombs become really nasty by creating a big chain reaction (boom) and then radiating the dust the explosion creates (aftermath) which then spreads everywhere.
Without a controlled explosion there will be significantly less radiating reactions and radioactive dust.
It’s like deep inhaling the smoke of a package of burning fire starters VS throwing said burning fire starter into a warehouse full of fireworks (and for the sake of this argument you cant leave the warehouse and have no equipment whatsoever)
Both will probably fuck you up a bit if you’re to close, but one is comparably insignificant.
But are we bringing nukes to a biological warfare… umm… party? Or hell, AI drones/nanobots?
In the game of nukes you don’t really need many.
You can destroy the world just so many times.
The rest is just for showing who has it bigger (the arsenal)
We would eventually crush Russia in a real war, the problem is that without going to actual war, we get to use only a small part of that.
Love the implication that the shitty imperialist anglo organization was ever credible.
NATO will kick us to the curb and rise to the challenge. We will need them one day and they will say no.
It will just be renamed to No America Treaty Organization
Technically not… They’d still have Canada.
Rename it NUTO. No US Treaty Org.
Don’t you dare call us American! Next thing you know we’ll stop apologizing for everything and actually build a military with jets instead of snowmobiles!
Sorry about that. Can I be Canadian now?
Can you skate and hit a top corner slapshot? If so, yes. Here’s your complimentary Tim’s card! That’s ten free coffees on the house!
Sorry, but I’m not a sports guy. I like maple syrup though, does that count for something?
Can you track down thieves? We’ve had issues with maple syrup heists!
I’ll try my best. But I’m an engineer, not a detective.
I’ll allow it.
It’s not the “no americas club,” they’re allowed 1
Expecting the US to not maintain its monopoly on the demonym “American” is the same thing as expecting dogs not to bark at the mailman. Other western hemisphere countries shouldn’t have dragged ass becoming independent.
It isn’t credible now. It likely won’t exist at all in 4 years. Unless it cedes even more decision making authority to the US and becomes even more of a puppet.
Doesn’t all authority already lie with the USA? If we’re going to be real, I mean. I’m sure France thinks otherwise but let’s be real: NATO was always the “Uncle Sam will protect Europe from Russia”-treaty.
France knows this, that’s why it wasn’t in NATO for most its history. This only changed when one of our president needed war crime buddies
The main point I was making is that Trump is almost certainly going to pull the US out of NATO altogether.
If not attempt to destroy it outright in an attempt to extort it.
Only if he gets attention or money for doing so. Those are his two gods, and he serves no others.
Well don’t forget Putin
He serves Putin because Putin gives him attention and money. It’s the same gods.
Putin also kinda obviously has some serious dirt on him
What dirt could he possibly have that the MAGA crowd gives two shits about?
Thank fuck we didn’t give up our nukes in the UK.
What does that accomplish?
Putin won’t invade you
By the time Russia is knocking at the door of the UK, its already game over.
That said, I would not want to be Polish right now.
Russia can barely project power across its own border, what chance has it got of projecting all the way to the British isles? We have more aircraft carriers than they do and ours actually work.
Russia is a spent force. All they have is their rusty old nukes as a threat and I highly doubt they’ll ever actually use them.
Autonomy.
Defense
Not a lot. The British weapons are reliant on US maintenance. Won’t be credible for long if the US doesn’t support them.
Isn’t this a bit like saying that because I drive a German car that’s maintained by the dealership, it’s not my car?
I’m sure it wouldn’t be tricky for the UK to move the Trident weapons program closer to home, or to align with allies in Europe (lol).
I’m sure it’s possible, but it’s not going to come for free nor will it be immediate
good?
No
it’s pretty good
NATO hasn’t been credible since they helped the US perpetrate a brutally violent colonialist pity party in Afghanistan.
🙏🙏🙏 here’s hoping 🙏🙏🙏
Now watch red maga walk back on that too, like all of blue/red maga promises.
The only good thing that could’ve possibly come out of this, and it won’t even happen.
It seems like a very real possibility. A new, EU followup seems like a natural next step to protect the borders and peace.
Next stage of russian ops will focus more heavily on splitting Europe now that UK and US have been severed off
It’s death by a thousand cuts and nobody seems to care. Smh
Straight out of Alexander Dugins book…
thanks! I couldn’t reminder who wrote it.
And later
He even used the term ‘special military operation’ in 1997…
His plan is certainly being implemented by putin
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Would be nice. Hungary tho 😤
Hungary can join the Russian union state alongside Belarus.
For people outside NATO it hasn’t been credible for a long time now.
NATO will be fine. They’ll just have to up their game a bit militarily. If America wants to be insular and wrap a flag of isolationism around them, it’ll hurt in the short term, but after four years of being more independent of Americas tit, its more than likely the US that will find itself less relevant globally.
Even before this, there was already rumblings, not just in China, but elsewhere, about ditching the american dollar standard and returning to the gold standard. That’s just going to gain momentum as soon as Trump starts trying to wave his mushroom around.
I mean if Europe wants to increase their military funding and move items in house I think that would be a wonderful idea. Because America is not a reliable partner in this at all in the past two decades.
If Europe gets into a war of course the US will help. But the same can’t really be said if the US gets into a war. The rest of NATO needs to be able to hold the fort if the US were to get suddenly …distracted in the Pacific
If Europe gets into a war of course the US will help.
How sure are you of that? Sure, if Russia marches towards the Atlantic Ocean, but if Russia decides to create a security buffer zone in Finland? Or the Baltic countries?
NATO has only survived for as long because of the commitment of the US. Come January NATO is dead as well as a sovereign Ukraine.
If Europe gets into a war, the US will side with Russia. Trump has been a Russian asset since the 80s, and it’s clear that he gave Putin classified documents relating to American spies and informants during his last presidency when they suddenly started dying a few days after he met with Putin. And even more classified documents relating to American espionage against Russia than the ones he requested before that meeting were found in Mar a la Go.
can you cite a source on the spies dying a few days after he met Putin? Not saying it’s not true, just curious.
Are you fucking stupid? Which is the only country to ever invoke article 5? How many other countries listened to the call for this injust war?
Are you fucking stupid?
yes.
The problem is that America has all the money.
The perfect excuse for the military industrial complex to move manufacturing overseas.
So I’m going to say that the military industrial complex is already there, it would simply be a rapid expansion.
Multiple EU countries want to, but they also want to give stuff to Ukraine and it’s difficult to do both.
The biggest thing will be all those nato countries who can’t do anything with their US weapons if the US says so.
That is only if they want to continue to buy new weapons, not if they intend to male weapons in Europe
No. I mean the weapons they have now. F35 for example. If a war happens in Europe, will those planes be useful without US support and authorizations? US can do a lot of harm to Europe with that.
Yes let me explain my answer I didn’t elaborate properly.
I think the only recourse the US has if European countries use these weapons without authorization is that the US will not sell more weapons.
And if Europe continues to intreases it’s weapon and ammunition production like they have the last two years that might not be a deal breaker for Europe
I’m not sure Europe can make F35 parts for example, which will not fly for long without it, or ammunitions for various US weapons. I hope it’ll be a wake up call to make and use EU instead.
Just my two cents as an assembly line guy: Parts on aircraft fall into three categories
-Big custom fuckoff parts. They’re not high tech but they’re huge and they’re a specific shape so you need a huge, precise and very expensive mould/die/whatever to make them. Anyone with the aircraft and a decent engineer could design a machine to make these parts but they would be left with a smoking crater where their wallet was after getting the mould made.
-Easy parts. Sure, an aircraft fuel pipe is worth 20k, but the civilian parts are made to higher standards anyways, we can find one no problem.
-Secret technical complex parts. Proprietary cutting edge stuff, which is frankly just bolted onto already complete aircraft. Obviously you can’t replace it if you don’t even know how it works, but the US doesn’t let that stuff out of their direct control very often anyways.
Don’t fucking talk to me about engines though, those are a whole different beast
TLDR: We can totally keep our F35s in the air as long as the parts we’re replacing aren’t the skin panels, the engines, or the Secret Third Thing. And as long as we have the money.
If only there was a country in europe that had voiced this concern in the 50s, all of that could have been avoided… Oh wait.
