This is going off the rails. Locking.
“I’ll take someone who wouldn’t talk to you if they were trapped in an elevator with you for $500 Alex.”
In my experience it’s so they can listen to exactly nothing you say in response and then say “oh you’ve totally been brainwashed” before refuting points I never even came close to making.
Is the answer not “A miserable little pile of secrets”?
I believe that would in fact be a man.
But enough talk. Have at you!
Then men are no different.
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I’d say “A slightly less miserable pile of secrets because they are generally more in tune with their emotions” but that doesn’t exactly roll off the tongue
The proper response to Charlie Kirk saying,‘I’m married to a woman’ is ‘How long did the Koch’s make her agree to it?’
I like “Well, I’m a straight male, so anything that turns me on is a woman, ma’am.”
Ooooh, that’s so subtle and brilliant, they’ll be destroyed for life! Added bonus is it zings for all the alphabet.
Name totally checks out.
It isn’t for me to define, and there are more important things in life to focus on.
I used to think 2 x chromosomes. Clearly I was wrong.
What if they have trisomy or monosomy?
What if they have a mutation and they don’t have the correct genes in their X and Y Chromosomes?
What if gender (a social construct) and biological sex aren’t actually the same thing?
What about just let people be because it’s none of your goddamned business how they want to express themselves, who they love, and why?
Whether a person has an XX chromosome or XY has absolutely no bearing on their body form.
Only a fool would gamble that just because a person looks like a woman that wt:thon is probably is XX, or just because a person looks like a man that thon probably is XY,
Did you skip the second and third words and entire second sentence of that comment, or what?
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“Metaphysics of gender.” Ppfffff hahahaha haha hahahaha. XD
What exactly would you call a philosophical discussion on the topic of what a gender means if not the metaphysics of gender?
I would just say “concept of gender”.
It’s a fair criticism to be honest. But, I can’t think of a reasonable alternative. When I support trans-individuals, usually I argue from the brain-body mapping perspective as 1) It’s not based on feelings as we know that there are people whose brain mapping does not correspond with their body mapping, and 2) There’s a lot of evidence to support that perspective.
A lot of people aren’t just going to get “What it feels like to a man/woman.”, and personally, while I identify as a man solely for my parts, I just simply lack what it means not because it supposedly matches me, but because I have no feelings associated with gender. And here’s the kicker, I wouldn’t understand dysphoria when called the wrong gender either. For example, my mother has always addresses me as a male because I was born with a penis and all that jazz, but recently a few months ago, in a endearing way, she told me that I was like a daughter to her, which I take to mean that I give off that energy to her. Didn’t really felt off or anything either.
As a trans person I find myself working backwards to try and figure out what makes a person cis and this experience you’ve described actually seems to me to be the most common. I theorize that most cis people (though not all) are actually defined by an absent or fluid internal gender.
I theorize that a lot of cis and trans people talking past each other has us trans folks assuming that you, like us, experience gender as something rigid and stratified. Like one of the aspects of my experience is that I have zero ability to feel neutrality about my body’s sex characteristics or about the way people culturally react to my body. Every interaction where my physical sex comes into play in how my life is lived is absolutely hard wired. Some make me feel deficient… Generally anxious and depressed because I feel almost indescribably cheated of comfort and invisible to the people whom with I feel an affinity which makes me feel utterly alone and stranded. Dysphoria - a gulf not between just body and mind but between life and something that feels like an opposite. Not death persay but an empty facsimile of existence where I am a non-entity obscured by a series of barriers.
Others make me feel inexplicable joy and connection and vibrantly alive. The random vendor who called me “sir” over a year ago when I was sure I didn’t pass isn’t just memorable it made my month. Gender euphoria is well named as it is heady and intoxicating. Not simply a respite from dysphoria but a golden shimmering stand out where the memory can be relived vividly.
The stratification of feeling - dysphoria and euphoria is so concrete but neither is at all logical. I believe very firmly that the sexes are equal and being a man is not better or worse than being a woman if you were to look at those things in a purely objective sense… But that doesn’t change a damn thing. This isn’t a logical thing. I can keep feeding it logic but it will never change the fact that as I go about my day I feel constantly slapped with intense feelings about my body.
But cis people don’t seem to feel anything about their gender so their uncertainty is natural. When they are completely non reactive to them the question of “how do you know?” is natural because when you reach down being told that you have an internal sense of gender and don’t find one then the natural response is doubt. But I think there is an underlying reason why the satisfaction rate of trans specific gender affirming surgeries is so low… If you are cis a change of physical kit might not actually be terribly alarming because that fluidity might work in your favour. The only risk to transitioning a cis person by accident might just be to fertility which not all people, particularly trans men, actually give up when they surgically transition. Meaning we might just be assuming incredible levels of harm from a population that a) is unlikely to care about sex enough to prioritize physical transition and b) might not be lifeshattering adversely effected and c) if they want to transition back they can. The culture that supports trans people is also nessisary in the rare event someone does want to go back because they will likely be externally still be read as a trans person and would essentially basically require the exact same accomodations.
The ftm equivalent is “What is a man?” And the proper response is “A miserable little pile of secrets”.
But enough talk… Have at you!
And then the bullies kick your ass.
Seems like: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sealioning
They’re not honestly curiously asking anything.
They tried to do a gotcha. Badly. And got gotcha’ed for it.
One question can’t be “sealioning”. Sure they aren’t curiously looking for an answer, but that’s not what sealioning is. Click your own link.
I saw a further video of them doing this type of thing before.
No need to be a douchebag.
You said what they’re doing seems like sealioning. Not sure how any of us are supposed to infer that you’re not talking about the subject content you’re commenting on.
I affirmed the rest of your opinion other than the trendy label you then put on it. Not sure why that makes me a douchebag, but then with me not being American there might be subtleties to the term that I’m not aware of like “calmly suggests you might be misusing a term”.
They called you a douchebag because your response was snippy and rude. “Click your own link” sounds condescending and arrogant.
You’re probably right. I can see how someone who sees being corrected as hurtful choosing to interpret a simple request that way, I suppose.
Personally I think the “woke” definition of a woman (if there even is one) is much more straightforward than the alternative. This idea that the left “can’t define a woman” is absurd projection - the very people who ask this question are the ones who can’t define it without having to make 100s of exceptions.
yep “someone who identifies as a woman” doesn’t need to have caveats. every biological argument has to have many.
Im trans, but this only works if you never rule out outliers, which is something a scientific term like female and its counterpart should be doing. There is a normal or default or whatever word youd prefer
first of all we’re not talking about science so it’s not really relevant, but…what do you even mean scientific terms should be ruling out outliers? if we do that we have faulty data and harmful medicine.
Because that’s the standard procedure for collecting experimental data and defining terms? Because the things that cause those outliers are usually influenced by things other than the thing being defined/observed
i don’t follow at all
The standard human body that biology supposes exists, does not exist.
The perfect human cadaver does not exist, there’s no cadaver that follows the models in books. All cadavers have weird shaped organs, in kinda weird spots, not symmetrical, little tumors and tendon issues and muscle issues etc. Same for their neurochemicals including hormones (and fyi people can get adrenal autoimmune disease later in life that can cause changes in sex features). Same for genes. Like especially genetically, we know everyone has different genes because that’s how DNA tests work in forensics.
No one is the standard and this is why many medical studies are super shitty and our medicine is so nonspecific. That’s why firstline treatment for depression is SSRIs even though they only have a 30% efficacy.
So the idea that “control” groups in medical studies are really made up of some kind of standard body is pure nonsense, unfortunately. They do not even investigate for hormones or other diseases really during these medical studies. If the drug itself will impact sex hormones, the study will describe what tests they ran and will investigate then, but if it’s a depression drug or heart drug etc, they just go off whatever the patient thinks. Genuinely. Our studies are so primitive.
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Oh look, an ignorant person who thinks trans 12-year-olds regularly get surgery rather than puberty blockers and maybe hormones.
But your not caring about children committing suicide is noted.
Hey, if it indeed reduces suicide, fine—even more reason for my indifference in them going for such procedures.
Among the 104 youths (13-20 years) who participated, 63 were transmasculine individuals (60.6%), 27 transfeminine individuals (26%), 10 nonbinary or gender fluid individuals (9.6%), and 4 individuals who didn’t know or did not respond to the gender identity question (3.8%).
60.6% transgirls?
Sylvia Plath on being a girl: https://youtu.be/1pTPuoGjQsI?t=982 (cued)
Why does anyone give a shit what Sylvia Plath, a woman who died before being trans was even legal, thinks about what it means to be a girl?
Also, she committed suicide herself, so I have no idea why you think she’s a good person to bring up.
Also, I think it’s hilarious you’re bringing up genetics in one comment as a definition of a woman and then bringing up a fucking poet as the definer in this one.
She lived in a different time: I’m sure if many of Gen Z lived in her time, a few of them might consider suicide; and my point is the gender dysphoria among girls might be due to sexism that’s still in society: hence the cure might not be becoming a boy, but rather reduce the sexism.
And the scientific basis of your hypothesis is what Sylvia Plath once said?
She said being a girl, or female, can be restraining, particularly over 50 years ago.
You claimed to know how to “cure” transgender people (it’s not an illness, you’re being a bigot). What is the science you are using?
No.
I’m presuming that we have sexism in our society and it’s affecting girls at least somewhat, but hey, what do I know?
Yes, sexism like yours does affect trans girls. It’s good of you to recognize it.
Gender is performative. Race is not.
Which is why we celebrate Jenner and we scorn Dolezal.
My personal favorite response to that question is “a person who covers their drink when you enter the room”
“Someone who chooses the bear over you.”
I’m stealing both of these.
Also trying to workshop::
Oh they don’t have them on your planet?
how about, “a person who doesn’t want to have sex with you.”
That doesn’t work. I’m sure plenty of queer men would be too disgusted by them to want to have sex with them either.
What about ‘I’ll ask your mom what she thinks when I see her tonight’?
Better: “I’ll ask your dad what she thinks when I see her tonight.”
Thank you flyingSquid. Perfect.
Nailed it 😎
Puerile, but it’s well catered to the audience.
I like it, but that’s like a 1960s sitcom tier insult. It’s too cute to infuriate.
They have 1960s sitcom mentality. Wouldn’t hurt to give it a try.
I do not have to have human rights? 😢
