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- cross-posted to:
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But that’s seawater
Could be a large lake.
honse
Step away from the water, Comrade Shark Fucker
I’ve always looked at Linux users as the vegans of the computer world. You know they have a point but holy shit can shut up about it for like 5 minutes?
I think there is just a portion of humans that love feeling morally superior, I imagine if annoying vegans or open source zealots tried crossfit they’d never shut up about that either.
What does crossfit have to do with morality?
Nothing, the point I was making is that annoying vegans and linux users would be annoying know-it-alls who never shut up about what they love and feel strongly about regardless of what activity they engage in. Crossfit also has zealots that are famously annoying, so it seemed like an easy way to illustrate my point without getting in the weeds like I have done now. Nothing to do with moral philosophy, annoying people are annoying.
Ironically this comment kind of implies an air of superiority over those who enjoy feeling superior, ever completing the infinite circle.
I’m a Linux user and I cross fit. I’m terrible at it and it means I’m sore all the time, but I’m trying. I don’t tell many people because I’m really struggling with it, but I want at least a small amount of physical fitness to keep up with my kids
Sure and I would imagine most linux users, vegans, and crossfitters are like you. But those three all have notably annoying individuals in thier ranks and I was meaning that annoying people are annoying, not that there is anything wrong with veganism, open source, or physical health
I don’t think I’ve ever met a vegan who talked about it in contexts outside of organizing food for multiple people or in response to others asking about it.
I think it’s mostly that non-vegetarians (of whom I am one) know deep down that at least the vegetarians[1] are right and that they don’t like being reminded of their moral failings. Thus every time they plan getting food for a group and the vegans mention their culinary restrictions, they feel attacked and try to compensate for it by blaming the vegans.
[1] I’ve encountered to many people reporting that they experienced serious health issues with going full vegan, so I’m very much not convinced that veganism is something that works for everyone long term. The same issues do however clearly not apply to vegetarianism.
You dont know the ones who don’t talk about it constantly.
Applies to both Linux users and vegans.
True I know, in both cases, the annoying type are a vocal minority.
I think in both cases you have a small and vocal minority within the group. Then you have the silent majority who never preach but just enjoy the lifestyle and the benefits it brings them.
That does explain why there are always outspoken vegans inside my echo chambers.
linux, vegans, leftists, etc.; doesn’t matter if they’re right, just fuck 'em. lol
Also, every other week we get another reason to make it a priority
The arguments against it boil down to “it’s different and scary/I don’t understand it”, “there’s compatibility issues that might be complicated to fix”, or “well what we have now is good enough for my needs”
And in both cases the opposition shoves their position down everyones throats but since its the societal norm nobody thinks about it. For example nearly every computer comes with Winbloat yet nobody asks why because obviously when you purchase a computer you want Microshafts software shoved down your throat (and you want to pay extra for the privilege). Also nearly every single news organization exists to act in the will of capital but that’s ok because capitalists decide whats socially acceptable.
and they can never present a unified front
I’m using ubuntu by the way 🤓
If you’re a gamer I recommend Pop_OS if not Debian, otherwise feel free to keep using a distro thats good enough yet worse then others.
do you condone the actions of Cannonical and the fact their name is Infuriatingly similar to cannon.
He a little confused, but he got the spirit
And I’m a post-left anti-civ Egoist Anarchist
See? Same thing
Should I like tell you that ur like wrong or sumthin? Cus I will lol /j
OK critique:
Ubuntu is relatively closed/restricted compared to some other Linux distros. Its reliance on Snaps is concerning because its a closed ecosystem (open source client, closed source backend, no option to add other source repos).Bad critique:
Um🤚🤓, actually you should be using security hardened NixOS using your own custom kernel sysctl config 🥵, using GrapheneOS’s hardened-malloc and chrony.conf 🥸, and Tor Browser installed inside a kata-container and sandbox with Bubblejail🤯. All compiled from source, duh. 🥱You seem knowledgeable about this and I know it’s not entirely relevant but I’m planning to swap to Linux soon, what distro would you reccomend I start with?
Linux mint if you don’t plan to learn the ecosystem in detail, Manjaro if you have cold feet about wanting to learn the ecosystem, Artix, Arch or Nix if you want to learn the ecosystem.
There’s many adjacent options but hopefully that gives you some direction
Probably Aurora by UniversalBlue
…Ubuntu.
GrapheneOS hardened_malloc is great though
So is most of my “nerd voice” bad response. It just isn’t for everyone, or very accessible to the majority of people. Only if you specialize in, or work a lot with, operating system security/privacy is it viable. I hope it becomes more accessible. Troubleshooting fuckin sucks.
troubleshooting sucks, and also, the default security model of desktop linux terrifies me. i legitimately don’t understand how i can be running all this random code off the internet without being pwned. i figure i probably can’t, and that it’s really just a matter of time until something real bad happens.
i went down the “sandbox everything” rabbit hole, and 6 months later random stuff still pops up like “trying to connect to an IPv6 link-local address at this LAN party… wait why don’t i have an IPv6 link-local address? i know IPv6 connectivity works fine when i’m at home.” turns out those NetworkManager hardening patches i’ve been meaning to upstream forever break SLAAC, and now i’m too worried what other edge-cases they break to try pushing them upstream, and now i understand why distros all run these things as root with access to way more resources than they probably need 🫤
Most people will just say “Read theory” or recommend a book that has nothing to do with the topic.
That said, you should totally read “An Appeal to the Young” by Kropotkin and you will understand
Fuck this one hurts.
Twice.
Here’s a decent quote from Linus semi-regarding the topic of people debating over tiny things
One final note: the reason I’m so negative about this all is that the random number subsystem has such an absolutely horrendous history of two main conflicting issues: People wanting reasonable usable random numbers on one side, And then the people that discuss what the word “entropy” means on the other side.
Also it’s open source, which is unironically communist, unless you’re one of those right-libertarian weirdos that go “no, communism is when the state owns the means of production, capitalism is when the worker, and the CEO and the investors are workers!” every time you mention them that communism isn’t when the state owns things.
or if you’re one of the founders of the open source movement, like ESR
I hate how true it is. Such a sadness
I mean it IS an anarchy and socialism driven idea. You do something for free and just allow others to use it and to help you.
Even if this person did not have any glue about anything, the premise was right.
Let me interject for a moment,
What you are referring to as Linux, is in fact, GNU/Linux, or as I’ve recently taken to calling it, GNU plus Linux. Linux is not an operating system unto itself, but rather another free component of a fully functioning GNU system made useful by the GNU corelibs, shell utilities and vital system components comprising a full OS as defined by POSIX. Many computer users run a modified version of the GNU system every day, without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of GNU which is widely used today is often called “Linux”, and many of its users are not aware that it is basically the GNU system, developed by the GNU Project. There really is a Linux, and these people are using it, but it is just a part of the system they use. Linux is the kernel: the program in the system that allocates the machine’s resources to the other programs that you run. The kernel is an essential part of an operating system, but useless by itself; it can only function in the context of a complete operating system. Linux is normally used in combination with the GNU operating system: the whole system is basically GNU with Linux added, or GNU/Linux. All the so-called “Linux” distributions are really distributions of GNU/Linux. Thank you for taking your time to cooperate with with me, your friendly GNU+Linux neighbor, Richard Stallman.
No, Richard, it’s ‘Linux’, not ‘GNU/Linux’. The most important contributions that the FSF made to Linux were the creation of the GPL and the GCC compiler. Those are fine and inspired products. GCC is a monumental achievement and has earned you, RMS, and the Free Software Foundation countless kudos and much appreciation.
Following are some reasons for you to mull over, including some already answered in your FAQ.
One guy, Linus Torvalds, used GCC to make his operating system (yes, Linux is an OS – more on this later). He named it ‘Linux’ with a little help from his friends. Why doesn’t he call it GNU/Linux? Because he wrote it, with more help from his friends, not you. You named your stuff, I named my stuff – including the software I wrote using GCC – and Linus named his stuff. The proper name is Linux because Linus Torvalds says so. Linus has spoken. Accept his authority. To do otherwise is to become a nag. You don’t want to be known as a nag, do you?
(An operating system) != (a distribution). Linux is an operating system. By my definition, an operating system is that software which provides and limits access to hardware resources on a computer. That definition applies whereever you see Linux in use. However, Linux is usually distributed with a collection of utilities and applications to make it easily configurable as a desktop system, a server, a development box, or a graphics workstation, or whatever the user needs. In such a configuration, we have a Linux (based) distribution. Therein lies your strongest argument for the unwieldy title ‘GNU/Linux’ (when said bundled software is largely from the FSF). Go bug the distribution makers on that one. Take your beef to Red Hat, Mandrake, and Slackware. At least there you have an argument. Linux alone is an operating system that can be used in various applications without any GNU software whatsoever. Embedded applications come to mind as an obvious example.
Next, even if we limit the GNU/Linux title to the GNU-based Linux distributions, we run into another obvious problem. XFree86 may well be more important to a particular Linux installation than the sum of all the GNU contributions. More properly, shouldn’t the distribution be called XFree86/Linux? Or, at a minimum, XFree86/GNU/Linux? Of course, it would be rather arbitrary to draw the line there when many other fine contributions go unlisted. Yes, I know you’ve heard this one before. Get used to it. You’ll keep hearing it until you can cleanly counter it.
You seem to like the lines-of-code metric. There are many lines of GNU code in a typical Linux distribution. You seem to suggest that (more LOC) == (more important). However, I submit to you that raw LOC numbers do not directly correlate with importance. I would suggest that clock cycles spent on code is a better metric. For example, if my system spends 90% of its time executing XFree86 code, XFree86 is probably the single most important collection of code on my system. Even if I loaded ten times as many lines of useless bloatware on my system and I never excuted that bloatware, it certainly isn’t more important code than XFree86. Obviously, this metric isn’t perfect either, but LOC really, really sucks. Please refrain from using it ever again in supporting any argument.
Last, I’d like to point out that we Linux and GNU users shouldn’t be fighting among ourselves over naming other people’s software. But what the heck, I’m in a bad mood now. I think I’m feeling sufficiently obnoxious to make the point that GCC is so very famous and, yes, so very useful only because Linux was developed. In a show of proper respect and gratitude, shouldn’t you and everyone refer to GCC as ‘the Linux compiler’? Or at least, ‘Linux GCC’? Seriously, where would your masterpiece be without Linux? Languishing with the HURD?
If there is a moral buried in this rant, maybe it is this:
Be grateful for your abilities and your incredible success and your considerable fame. Continue to use that success and fame for good, not evil. Also, be especially grateful for Linux’ huge contribution to that success. You, RMS, the Free Software Foundation, and GNU software have reached their current high profiles largely on the back of Linux. You have changed the world. Now, go forth and don’t be a nag.
I understand some of these words
A perfect example of the meme.
Systemd/Linux is more accurate imo lol.
Both also spend more time talking shit about one another and infighting than actually piling up against the so called common enemies.
my brain for some reason replaced “Linux” with “Lemmy” but it still made sense x3
