debates fine but you don’t need to finish it or win it. Its a process.
Actually, debate between hostile strangers online serves an important role in churning up internet drama. This is vital to the continued survival of the popcorn industry.
Also, the debate crowd doesn’t actually want to hear you to change their minds if new information is presented, they just want a platform to parrot their bullshit in a way they look legit and smart, and they can’t do that without the debate. So, as usual, don’t feed the troll.
The only reason to engage is for lurkers who might not know better and need to see a way out of the pipeline before they go in too deep.
They’re absolutely being disingenuous, but I think it’s important to keep in mind that the purpose of debate is not generally to change the mind of the person you’re debating with. It’s intended to be done with an audience (or judges in a formal competitive debate), and it’s the audience that you’re trying to sway to your side.
Objective Materialism vs Subjective Idealism go brr
I like this.
If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past. It is not that they are afraid of being convinced. They fear only to appear ridiculous or to prejudice by their embarrassment their hope of winning over some third person to their side.
-Sartre
Two additional sentences at the end of the often posted quote from “Anti-Semite and Jew”. Those two sentences were always included in the quote when I first saw it making it’s round years ago. Now it takes hunting to find the complete quote. Most sites cut it off after “the time for argument is past”. I wonder who would benefit from us forgetting those last two sentences.
Unfortunately, social media is highly influencial of public opinion, so it is a civic responsibility that those with life experience and expertise with things need to engage in. Failure to do so effectively is rolling over for
MAGANazis 2.0.We need to be better at rhetoric and debate. Cicero wrote over 2 millenia ago about the power of eloquence.
"Wisdom without eloquence does too little for the good of communities, but eloquence without wisdom is, in most instances, extremely harmful and never beneficial. If, then, anyone exerts all of his energies in the practice of oratory to the neglect of the highest and most honorable pursuits of reason and moral conduct, he is reared as a citizen useless to himself and harmful to his country; but the person who arms himself with eloquence in such a way that enables him not to assault the interest of his country, but rather assist them, this man, in my opinion, will be a citizen most helpful and most devoted both to his own interests and those of the public.”
In recent years, the unwise have weaponized eloquence. The wise among us have failed spectacularly at understanding the importance and power of persuasion.
Nazis making shit up and moderation failing to silence them is not a question of eloquence. Fuck off with that.
Won’t somebody feed the trolls?!
Trolls like you?
Peaceful arguments is just not a thing online. There is no learning nor seeing the other perspective - Just people being defensive and manipulative.
If it were constructive it would be called a discussion, not an argument or debate.
It unfortunately also not a thing in real life. Tried to convince my mother’s partner that transphobia and homophobia is bad. Best I could do is to him admit it was not about “protecting the children”.
It never has been and never will be about protecting the children, not with the full roster of diddlers they keep in positions of authority…
A human trafficking minor fucker was tapped for AG.
Roy Moore, the guy that was supposed to replace Jeff Sessions as senator wasn’t allowed in the mall. Too diddly.
“They’re not sending their best.”
I know it’s wrong and primarily unjustified to think this, but sometimes I feel that we’ve evolved not at all as a species. We’ve developed fancier stuff, but barbarism is alive and well. It’s just wearing an expensive suit now.
Looks around
I’d say it’s justified.
It is possible, but especially in the bigger communities its usually just throwing poop at each other(that’s at least my experience).
Yeah I’ve burned a depressing amount of time in conversations that aren’t going somewhere. And yet, I keep finding myself back at that toxic ass watering hole 😔
You win debates for onlookers, you’re not meant to change the perspective of the person you’re debating, you’re meant to make them look like idiots so that any lurkers who quietly agree feel bad and change their viewpoint. The left lost because they weren’t willing to do this hard enough.
The on lookers don’t care. That’s why they are on lookers. The best you might do is prevent someone searching for an ideology blindly adopting some rando’s. Honestly, though, if they are letting rando’s arguing online form their worldview you are far from actually helping them.
They don’t care consciously, but subconsciously they’ll know and remember the time and idea was defended badly whenever it comes up, especially if their knowledge on it is a blank or close to blank slate.
If you make it entertaining and thus a source of dopamine, and even better yet very consumable - you’ve got bonafide content and then people start caring, even if it’s only for lulz.
They’ll associate your views with intelligent witty dunks and the dopamine they bring and have a favourable view of them.
That’s both the model of the “Le angry feminazis!” reaction channels of the post-gamergate world and the hbomberguys of the world, especially his earliee stuff.
yes i agree that jd vance should die.
I argue to check if my opinions are popular in the community I’m in. If I get more positive engagement then I know I’m probably in the right place.
Test your echo chambers, as they say
Wow thank you for this meme. The comments in the post above this one were absolute dog shit, and I seriously was on the verge of engaging with them. I didn’t engage. Yayyyy
I absolutely disagree and want you to change your opinion right now!
Ah yeah? But what if I call you a big Chicken-Butt?
/s
That’s what I get for guessing what 😔
Love this ❤️
Anything that costs me peace of mind is too expensive for my tastes
This is something I wish I’d learned many years ago
