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China’s firewall plays a crucial role in shaping the country’s digital landscape, preventing foreign intervention, and maintaining national security. While often criticized in the West, the firewall provides China with the ability to control information flow, shield its population from foreign influence, and protect domestic media.
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People when talking about EU banning US social media and fostering domestically-based networks: hell yeah 😎😎😎
When China does it: evil commies! Brainwashed! Chinese people are too stupid to see they’re being manipulated!
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I have 4 channels I don’t use that have basically no content on them but are a decade old. Why do you think this shit matters?
At any point in time I might turn them into channels for any kind of content, you will only scream that it’s propaganda if the content I start producing is about China though because you’re a racist. If it’s any other subject that suddenly appears on a 10 year old account you just won’t care.
You think everything is something sinister instead of considering the fact that it’s almost certainly not. Almost anyone here might do the same with old accounts they have, why is that a problem?
Sounds like he’s receiving gifts in return for positive Chinese propaganda.
lmao why the fuck do you think this is necessary when there’s literally hundreds of thousands of marxists who believe in the communist future that would do it for free? You don’t seem to understand communists at all. You’ve so heavily bought into the koolaid of capitalism that you can’t even wrap your head around the idea that communists don’t need monetary incentives to do things to promote communism. “Everyone must be getting paid because getting paid is the only reason anyone does anything!” is the principle contradiction that makes you mis-analyse everything, it’s one of many reasons why capitalists will certainly lose, your belief in capitalism makes you fundamentally misjudge reality. How can you ever hope to win if you can’t analyse reality correctly?
You’re chasing ghosts. Things that do not exist. Ethereal non-existent payments to do communist propaganda. While you’re chasing these ghosts you’re completely failing to counter the real thing going on - that there are hundreds of thousands of us willing to do it for free. You miss this completely and entirely fail to counter it because your belief in capitalism is so complete that you can only imagine someone needing to be paid to do this.
Ironically capitalists can’t ever fix this. Your propaganda itself makes you this way. Your belief in capitalism makes you this way. If you didn’t believe in the fact everyone needs monetary incentives to do anything then you wouldn’t be capitalists at all. It fucking dooms you.
Why do you think this shit matters?
They read one Tweet or at best an article from an OSINT guy about how influence operations have started to heavily rely on necro accounts to prevent moderation policies of age from affecting their reach. So much like a child learning about ghosts, he sees ghosts everywhere.
Apt way to describe it. They’re telling ghost stories. Tall tales under a upward pointed flashlight.
cry harder
They cried so hard that they deleted their month old account 🤷
It’s probably healthy for them to take a step away from social media and go touch grass for a while.
Lmfao, hope they crawled back to reddit
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China doesn’t have to pay people for propaganda, just existing and investing in their infrastructure makes them visibly better than the US and the vast majority of our lackey nations
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China has like half the pollution of us or are you gonna do that thing liberals do where they suddenly don’t understand what per capita is when this topic comes up.
The US tried to foment division in China by funding and organizing terrorist cells in Xinjiang, and once those efforts failed, it concocted and promoted a genocide narrative.
- The Xinjiang Genocide Allegations Are Unjustified
- The Uyghur Human Rights Project is a product of the National Endowment for Democracy, which is the American government’s main regime change NGO.
- Uyghur genocide allegations
- American Debunks All Major Western Propaganda on Uyghurs and Xinjiang
- US-Funded Uyghur Activists Train as Soldiers of Empire
- A Reddit AMA Claiming To Be A Uyghur Quickly Exposes A CIA Asset Slandering China
- The blueprint of regime change operations How regime change happens in the 21st century with your consent
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How about you try suspecting western media for once instead of taking US propaganda at face value and loudly parroting it online and getting butthurt when people correct you
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No, you don’t. No, there isn’t.
International media eagerly corroborated US allegations of Iraq having WMDs too, that was also a lie. Media you like saying a thing isn’t evidence that the thing is real.
If you had actual evidence you could persuade other people who see this post even if you didn’t convince me, you’re not trying because you have none and you know it.
I absolutely do hate you, you’re an arrogant ignorant chauvinistic dipshit, but I take significant comfort in knowing that the impending american century of humiliation will humble you.
There’s a TON of media that corroborates the information
Post one (1) thing then. Literally a single thing. You’ve said some version of “of course I have sources for my beliefs” in quite a few comments, but every time anyone asks you to post just one, a single source, you refuse, saying something like “you wouldn’t believe me anyway”. Do you see how that’s not convincing? Do you understand how that makes us think you actually haven’t really thought through your beliefs and have actually just inherited them from the propaganda environment you exist in?
What a magnanimous statement, one could almost forget it’s being shouted over your shoulder as you run away.
Then I suggest developing real media literacy.
If everything is suspect, do you just not read any of it?
And yet in your previous comment you confidently regurgitated lies you failed to vet yourself. Do you not see the ridiculous level of hypocrisy you are displaying here? You demanded some vague notion of thorough vetting from the people you are talking to and when provided with a wealth of sources that support the video, your next response is “I ain’t reading all that”. Also, whether you admit it to yourself or not there is deep deep seated white supremacy you have internalized and it is very obvious for all to see, so maybe reflect on that too.
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Do you think I have a copypasta prepared for all of my views with cited sources?
Well you seem to think some youtuber should, so what makes you special?
you confidently regurgitated lies you failed to vet yourself
Yes, you clearly do not hold yourself to the same standard as you demand from others, because you outright listed multiple things as fact that were immediately debunked. You ask others to rigorously vet this video (which we showed the sources for) and yet you refuse to actually vet any information yourself. Everything you have said in this entire thread has been false, the only conclusion I can draw is that you thought you could come in here and stir shit up, but you are getting frustrated at people tearing your assertions to shreds.
I am once again inviting libs to xiaohongshu to see the uyghur culture featured front and center when you search for it. The language, the music, the art, the script, the stories. Did you know there is a made for tv puppet show of nasreddin hoca’s stories, known there as Afanti? You can see for yourself, from the comfort of the couch what the Uyghur culture, that is supposedly being erased, features. In a chinese app. Thats predominantly for chinese people. Go look for yourself.
The Uyghurs in Xinjiang
Anti-Communists and Sinophobes claim that there is an ongoing genocide-- a modern-day holocaust, even-- happening right now in China. They say that Uyghur Muslims are being mass incarcerated; they are indoctrinated with propaganda in concentration camps; their organs are being harvested; they are being force-sterilized. These comically villainous allegations have little basis in reality and omit key context.
Background
Xinjiang, officially the Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region, is a province located in the northwest of China. It is the largest province in China, covering an area of over 1.6 million square kilometers, and shares borders with eight other countries including Afghanistan, Kazakhstan, Russia, Mongolia, India, and Pakistan.
Xinjiang is a diverse region with a population of over 25 million people, made up of various ethnic groups including the Uyghur, Han Chinese, Kazakhs, Tajiks, and many others. The largest ethnic group in Xinjiang is the Uyghur who are predominantly Muslim and speak a Turkic language. It is also home to the ancient Silk Road cities of Kashgar and Turpan.
In the aftermath of the Cold War, several factors contributed to a resurgence of separatist sentiment among Uyghur nationalists in Xinjiang. Since the early 2000s, there have been a number of violent incidents attributed to extremist Uyghur groups in Xinjiang including bombings, shootings, and knife attacks. Some high-profile examples include:
- Ürümqi bombings (2014): SUVs were driven into a busy street market in Ürümqi, the capital of Xinjiang. Up to a dozen explosives were thrown at shoppers from the windows of the SUVs. The SUVs crashed into shoppers, then collided with each other and exploded. 43 people were killed and more than 90 wounded.
- Kunming train station attack (2014): A group of 8 knife-wielding Uyghur separatists attacked passengers in the Kunming Railway Station in Kunming, Yunnan, China, killing 31 people, and wounding 143 others. The attackers pulled out long-bladed knives and stabbed and slashed passengers at random.
- Tiananmen Square attack (2013): A car ran over pedestrians and crashed in Tiananmen Square in Beijing, in a terrorist suicide attack. Five people died in the incident; three inside the vehicle and two others nearby. An additional 38 people were injured.
- Kashgar attack (2013): A group of Uyghur militants attacked a police station and government offices in Kashgar, killing 15 people and injuring more than 40 others.
- Kashgar attack (2011): Two Uyghur men hijacked a truck, killed its driver, and drove into a crowd of pedestrians. They got out of the truck and stabbed six people to death and injured 27 others.
- Ürümqi riots (2009): Ethnic riots erupted in Ürümqi. They began as a protest, but escalated into violent attacks that mainly targeted Han people. A total of 197 people died, most of whom were Han people or non-Muslim minorities, with 1,721 others injured and many vehicles and buildings destroyed.
- Kashgar attack (2008): Two men drove a truck into a group of approximately 70 jogging police officers, and proceeded to attack them with grenades and machetes, resulting in the death of sixteen officers.
In 2014-2016, the Chinese government launched a “Strike Hard” campaign to crack down on terrorism in Xinjiang, implementing strict security measures and detaining thousands of Uyghurs. In 2017, reports of human rights abuses in Xinjiang including mass detentions and forced labor, began to emerge.
The Material Conditions Necessary for Terrorism and Extremism
As materialists, we understand that terrorists don’t magically appear out of thin air. There are material reasons for people resorting to such extreme measures. In order to combat the threat of rising extremism, these reasons must be indentified and resolved. One of the main causes is economic marginalization. When people are economically disadvantaged or excluded from mainstream economic activity, they may be more likely to turn to extremism as a way to address their grievances and gain a sense of purpose. Generally speaking, people who feel like they have a bright future do not resort to terrorism. It is only when people feel hopeless or trapped that they resort to such measures.
If the issue is that the Uyghurs were disenfranchised, and that is the reason they were susceptible to religious fundamentalism and resorting to terrorism, then surely the solution is to enfranchise them to remove that material condition. This is what the Strike Hard campaign ultimately sought to accomplish.
Counterpoints
There is only flimsy evidence for the most egregious of the allegations being made about what China is doing in Xinjiang, it should be an easy matter to dismiss. Normally, the burden of evidence lies with the party making the claims. However, Western media is happy to spread rumours and present the allegations as having merit because it serves America’s imperialist interests. Additionally, given the severity of the allegations and the gravity of the crimes China is being accused of, this issue has been taken very seriously by the international community, especially the international Muslim community.
The Organisation of Islamic Cooperation (OIC) is the second largest organization after the United Nations with a membership of 57 states spread over four continents. The OIC released Resolutions on Muslim Communities and Muslim Minorities in the non-OIC Member States in 2019 which:
- Welcomes the outcomes of the visit conducted by the General Secretariat’s delegation upon invitation from the People’s Republic of China; commends the efforts of the People’s Republic of China in providing care to its Muslim citizens; and looks forward to further cooperation between the OIC and the People’s Republic of China.
In this same document, the OIC expressed much greater concern about the Rohingya Muslim Community in Myanmar, which the West was relatively silent on.
Over 50+ UN member states (mostly Muslim-majority nations) signed a letter (A/HRC/41/G/17) to the UN Human Rights Commission approving of the de-radicalization efforts in Xinjiang:
…separatism and religious extremism has caused enormous damage to people of all ethnic groups in Xinjiang, which has seriously infringed upon human rights, including right to life, health and development. Faced with the grave challenge of terrorism and extremism, China has undertaken a series of counter-terrorism and deradicalization measures in Xinjiang, including setting up vocational education and training centers. Now safety and security has returned to Xinjiang and the fundamental human rights of people of all ethnic groups there are safeguarded. The past three consecutive years has seen not a single terrorist attack in Xinjiang and people there enjoy a stronger sense of happiness, fulfillment and security. We note with appreciation that human rights are respected and protected in China in the process of counter-terrorism and deradicalization.
We appreciate China’s commitment to openness and transparency. China has invited a number of diplomats, international organizations officials and journalist to Xinjiang to witness the progress of the human rights cause and the outcomes of counter-terrorism and deradicalization there. What they saw and heard in Xinjiang completely contradicted what was reported in the media. We call on relevant countries to refrain from employing unfounded charges against China based on unconfirmed information before they visit Xinjiang.
The World Bank sent a team to investigate in 2019 and found that, “The review did not substantiate the allegations.” (See: World Bank Statement on Review of Project in Xinjiang, China)
Even if you believe the deradicalization efforts are wholly unjustified, and that the mass detention of Uyghur’s amounts to a crime against humanity, it’s still not genocide. Even the U.S. State Department’s legal experts admit as much:
The U.S. State Department’s Office of the Legal Advisor concluded earlier this year that China’s mass imprisonment and forced labor of ethnic Uighurs in Xinjiang amounts to crimes against humanity—but there was insufficient evidence to prove genocide, placing the United States’ top diplomatic lawyers at odds with both the Trump and Biden administrations, according to three former and current U.S. officials.
State Department Lawyers Concluded Insufficient Evidence to Prove Genocide in China | Colum Lynch, Foreign Policy. (2021)
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You have yet to post a single source. For someone that claims to be rational sure are acting emotionally.
It might not require a lot of effort to paste it but it definitely took a lot of effort to assemble, clearly far more effort than you’ve put into thinking about it
A Comparative Analysis: The War on Terror
China is not the only country to have faced faced a challenge of this nature. The United States, in the wake of “9/11”, saw the threat of terrorism and violent extremism due to religious fundamentalism as a matter of national security. They invaded Afghanistan in October 2001 in response to the 9/11 attacks, with the goal of ousting the Taliban government that was harbouring Al-Qaeda. The US also launched the Iraq War in March 2003, which was justified by the Bush administration as a response to Iraq’s alleged possession of weapons of mass destruction and links to terrorism. However, these claims turned out to be unfounded.
A former commander of NATO’s forces in Europe, [retired General Wesley] Clark claims he met a senior military officer in Washington in November 2001 who told him the Bush administration was planning to attack Iraq first before taking action against Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Iran, Somalia and Sudan…
Clark says after the 11 September 2001 attacks, many Bush administration officials seemed determined to move against Iraq, invoking the idea of state sponsorship of terrorism, “even though there was no evidence of Iraqi sponsorship of 9/11 whatsoever”…
He also condemns George Bush’s notorious Axis of Evil speech made during his 2002 State of the Union address. “There were no obvious connections between Iraq, Iran, and North Korea,” says Clark…
Instead, Clark points the finger at what he calls “the real sources of terrorists – US allies in the region like Egypt, Pakistan, and Saudi Arabia”.
Clark blames Egypt’s “repressive policies”, Pakistan’s “corruption and poverty, as well as Saudi Arabia’s “radical ideology and direct funding” for creating a pool of angry young men who became “terrorists”.
US ‘plans to attack seven Muslim states’ | Al Jazeera (2003)
According to a report by Brown University’s Costs of War project, at least 897,000 people, including civilians, militants, and security forces, have been killed in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Syria, Yemen, and other countries. Other estimates place the total number of deaths at over one million. The report estimated that many more may have died from indirect effects of war such as water loss and disease. The war has also resulted in the displacement of tens of millions of people, with estimates ranging from 37 million to over 59 million.
The War on Terror also popularized such novel concepts as the “Military-Aged Male” which allowed the US military to exclude civilians killed by drone strikes from collateral damage statistics. (See: ‘Military Age Males’ in US Drone Strikes)
In summary:
- The U.S. responded by invading or bombing half a dozen countries regardless of their actual connection to the attackers, directly killing nearly a million and displacing tens of millions from their homes.
- China responded with a program of deradicalization and vocational training.
Which one of those responses sounds genocidal?
Side note: It is practically impossible to actually charge the U.S. with war crimes, because of the Hague Invasion Act.
#Who is driving the Uyghur genocide narrative?
Let’s review some of the people and organizations involved in strongly promoting this narrative.
One of the main proponents of these narratives is Adrian Zenz, a German far-right fundamentalist Christian and Senior Fellow and Director in China Studies at the Victims of Communism Memorial Foundation, who believes he is “led by God” on a “mission” against China has driven much of the narrative. His anti-Communist and anti-China stances influence his work and makes him selective in his use of data. He relies heavily on limited and questionable data sources, particularly from anonymous and unverified Uyghur sources, coming up with estimates based on assumptions which are not supported by concrete evidence. He also ignores the broader historical and political context of the situation in Xinjiang, such as the history of separatist movements and terrorism in the region.
The World Uyghur Congress, headquartered in Germany, is funded by the National Endowment for Democracy (NED) which is a tool of U.S. foreign policy, using funding to support organizations that promote American interests rather than the interests of the local communities they claim to represent.
Radio Free Asia (RFA) is part of a larger project of U.S. imperialism in Asia, one that seeks to control the flow of information, undermine independent media, and advance American geopolitical interests in the region. Rather than providing an objective and impartial news source, RFA is a tool of U.S. foreign policy, one that seeks to shape the narrative in Asia in ways that serve the interests of the U.S. government and its allies.
The first country to call the treatment of Uyghurs a genocide was the United States of America. In 2021, the Secretary of State declared that China’s treatment of Uyghurs and other ethnic and religious minorities in Xinjiang constitutes “genocide” and “crimes against humanity.” Both the Trump and Biden administrations upheld this line.
Why is this narrative being promoted?
As materialists, we should always look first to the economic base for insight into issues occurring in the superstructure. In this case, there is a compelling material reason for the US the promote a narrative of a genocide occurring in Xinjiang.
The Belt and Road Initiative (BRI) is a massive Chinese infrastructure development project that aims to build economic corridors, ports, highways, railways, and other infrastructure projects across Asia, Africa, Europe, and the Middle East. The project has been described as a new Silk Road, connecting China with its neighboring countries and expanding trade and economic ties with the rest of the world.
The BRI includes plans for major infrastructure projects in Xinjiang. These projects aim to improve connectivity and facilitate trade between China and countries in Central Asia and beyond. The Xinjiang region is critical part of the Belt.
For the United States, the BRI is a threat to its economic and political dominance. For one, the BRI could undermine US efforts to promote “free trade” agreements, which have often been used to lock in economic reforms and policies that benefit American corporations. The BRI also threatens to undermine US influence in key regions of the world, particularly in Asia and Africa, by providing countries with an alternative source of financing and investment that is not tied to US-led institutions like the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund.
Moreover, the BRI could help to shift the global balance of power away from the United States and towards China. By expanding its economic influence and deepening its ties with other countries, China could emerge as a more formidable competitor to the United States in the global arena.
Promoting the Uyghur genocide narrative harms China and benefits the US in several ways. It portrays China as a human rights violator which could damage China’s reputation in the international community and which could lead to economic sanctions against China; this would harm China’s economy and give American an economic advantage in competing with China. It could also lead to more protests and violence in Xinjiang, which could further destabilize the region and threaten the longterm success of the BRI.
Additional Resources
Video Essays:
- What’s daily life like for Uyghurs? A talk with Uyghur influencer Sabira Samat and Daniel Dumbrill. | Li Jingjing (2021)
- Cutting Through the BS on Xinjiang: Uyghur Genocide or Vocational Training? | BadEmpanada (2021)
- Discussing The Xinjiang/Uyghur “Genocide” With Bay Area 415 | Daniel Dumbrill (2020)
Books, Articles, or Essays:
- Egyptian media delegates provide a detailed insight of the situation in Xinjiang | (2019)
- The Xinjiang Atrocity Propaganda Blitz | Nia Frome (2021)
- Xinjiang: A Report and Resource Compilation | Qiao Collective (2021)
- Xinjiang: Understanding Complexity, Building Peace | International Diplomatic Institute (2021)
- Fight against Terrorism and Extremism in Xinjiang: Truth and Facts | Information Office of the People’s Government of Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region (2022)
Social Media Resources, Threads, and Masterposts:
- Twitter thread about the WUC | shaedon sharpe’s rifles via Twitter (2021) [Archive]
- List of fact checks | 8Bitsblu via r/communism (2020) [Archive]
- r/Sino wiki entry | FeatsOverComments via r/sino (2020)
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Lmao a plethora of evidence with sources is low effort but you plugging your ears and going “lalala” isn’t
You can’t make this shit up. The US has cooked it’s people’s minds.
You’re a fucking idiot
Good lord the sheer rudeness to someone taking effort to educate.
Don’t read, don’t think, don’t learn, stay inside, stay inside, stay inside, it’s nice inside, it’s safe inside, you don’t have to think inside, you don’t have to read inside, just stay inside. Shhhhh. Shhhhhhhhhhh. Its ok now, you’re inside now, you don’t need to fear the outside any more, little baby.
You can’t be fucking serious.
So not only doyou refuse to even engage with anything that doesn’t come from your pre approved list of sources when somebody takes rhe time to actually compile a bunch of sources and wrote up a summary for you that also isn’t acceptable.
It’s almost like you are completely fucking brainwashed to immediatly reject literally any sort of information that doesn’t match up with your personal opinion which just so happens to exactly match the opinion of the state department.
Americans truly are the most willfully ignorant propogandized people in the world.
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Is it low-effort? It sure looks high-effort to me. There are a ton of sources (some of them I hadn’t read before), it’s written really well, and organized quite nicely. Sure, it’s clearly copy-pasted, RedWizard didn’t write it fresh for this post, but like, so? If it’s good info written and sourced well, why not post it every time the question comes up? Someone new will see it every time, and they might dig into the sources and become more knowledgeable because of how well-organized and well-sourced this copy-pasted super informational post is.
What would you have had RedWizard post instead? A less well-organized piece that he wrote specifically for this comment thread? Something off-the-cuff and not so informative? Or maybe you wanted him to just post nothing. Perhaps you just expected everyone here to simply agree with you about the situation in Xinjiang, without doing any research of our own. Is that it? You wanted to come in here and parrot something you’ve heard other people say, not expecting any pushback. But then you got presented with contradictory evidence, so you called it low-effort to allow yourself to ignore it?
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It might not require a lot of effort to paste it but it definitely took a lot of effort to assemble, clearly far more effort than you’ve put into thinking about it
Zenz zenz zenz
Of course you trust the shady racist guy lol
Let us look at a specific example. A claim like “There’s cultural genocide of Uyghurs in Xinjiang” is simply unreal to most Westerners, close to pure gibberish. The words really refer to existing entities and geographies, but Westerners aren’t familiar with them. The actual content of the utterance as it spills out is no more complex or nuanced than “China Bad,” and the elementary mistakes people make when they write out statements of “solidarity” make that much clear. This is not a complaint that these people have not studied China enough — there’s no reason to expect them to study China, and retrospectively I think to some extent it was a mistake to personally have spent so much time trying to teach them. It’s instead an acknowledgment that they are eagerly wielding the accusation like a club, that they are in reality unconcerned with its truth-content, because it serves a social purpose.
What is this social purpose? Westerners want to believe that other places are worse off, exactly how Americans and Canadians perennially flatter themselves by attacking each others’ decaying health-care systems, or how a divorcee might fantasize that their ex-lover’s blooming love-life is secretly miserable. This kind of “crab mentality” is actually a sophisticated coping mechanism suitable for an environment in which no other course of action seems viable. Cognitive dissonance, the kind that eventually spurs one into becoming intolerant of the status quo and into action, is initially unpleasant and scary for everybody. In this way, we can begin to understand the benefit that “victims” of propaganda derive from carelessly “spreading awareness.” Their efforts feed an ambient propaganda haze of controversy and scandal and wariness that suffocates any painful optimism (or jealousy) and ensuing sense of duty one might otherwise feel from a casual glance at the amazing things happening elsewhere. People aren’t “falling” for atrocity propaganda; they’re eagerly seeking it out, like a soothing balm.
Just fyi this is the ML instance and it’s full of tankies - in case you’re confused by how many people suddenly seem fervently culty about China.
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There’s nothing “culty” about it you’re just being corrected by people who are better educated on the topic than you are
The only group I know of who is as good at ignoring the wealth of evidence to the contrary of their beliefs are MAGA. Your arguments are a lot more complex, I’ll give you that, but it doesn’t make you any less wrong.
Show us the evidence
No WMDs in Iraq, no genocide in China. Stay stupid patriot!
See that’s the difference between you and me - I’m under no illusions about either country.
The pollution is the direct result of other countries outsourcing their manufacturing to exploit chinese labor for increased profits, and they’re rapidly reducing that pollution with the infrastructure investments I mentioned. The censorship is clearly necessary, as evidenced by the US getting absolutely bodied by relatively simple online disinfo campaigns. And the ethnic cleansing is fictional, fucking duh. Uighurs are directly represented in the ruling party, their language is present in official documents and on their currency. Xinjiang is literally open to foreign tourism right now, you could go there yourself and learn better in person.
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There is no evidence at all for anything even remotely resembling an ethnic cleansing going on in China. If you don’t have the spine for admitting you were duped the next best thing would be to shut the fuck up entirely.
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Lol pure projection, try harder
China invited every country to send journalists and ambassadors to Xinjiang and none of them took them on that offer, why is that?
I would present evidence
please do
5 hours later…
They deleted all their posts lol.
I would present evidence, but there is no evidence
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Saying that like he didn’t mention in the video that he spent a long time in China
Of course seeing how far China has come in person would turn him into a commie lmao
damn i need to go to trinity college in dublin
yes dude, the 30k sub youtube channel is getting sponsored trips to China 😂
The westoid brain is so broken it thinks that the only way anyone can have a positive opinion of a country’s government is if that government is paying them.
I love the leap from:
- He went on a cruise, and
- He thinks China is a decent country, to
- CHINA MUST HAVE BRIBED HIM WITH A CRUISE!!!
It’s as absurd as me posting about a new bike, posting that I like the Steelers, and then someone concluding that Mike Tomlin must be paying me under the table for positive press.
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Lol right, gotta protect yourself from the wrongthink by ignoring all evidence that disagrees with you
Why is it untrust worthy?
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You haven’t explained to me why you don’t trust them, and you haven’t actually dismissed any of the video’s ideas or claims.
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You should watch it. They list all their sources in the video description. If your position is as strong as it is, then it should be able to stand up against this information, and you’ll walk away unbroken. You are literally plugging your ears for no reason. The fact that you won’t watch it only shows me that you know deep down your position doesn’t stand up against critique and fact. If it does, then watch it, tell us about all the things that are incorrect. Review the sources (I’ve copied them for you because I think you’re afraid to look at the video page) and tell us what is propaganda and what is fact, since you are such a highly attuned detector of such things.
Sources:
Meta censorship:
https://www.hrw.org/report/2023/12/21/metas-broken-promises/systemic-censorship-palestine-content-instagram-andTwitter censorship:
https://qz.com/elon-musk-x-twitter-transparency-brazil-turkey-tesla-1851656960Google leaves China:
https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2016/01/why-google-quit-china-and-why-its-heading-back/424482/Foreign intervention:
https://apnews.com/article/technology-cuba-united-states-government-904a9a6a1bcd46cebfc14bea2ee30fdfUkraine:
https://jacobin.com/2022/02/maidan-protests-neo-nazis-russia-nato-crimeaRomania:
https://www.leefang.com/p/ngos-backing-judicial-coup-in-romaniaGeorgia:
https://x.com/RnaudBertrand/status/1795638929837961462https://x.com/RnaudBertrand/status/1794056909672362191
https://x.com/sopjap/status/1886351945083785418
Regime Change:
https://global.chinadaily.com.cn/a/202205/08/WS6277847fa310fd2b29e5b4c2.htmlAmerican free speech censorship:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/mar/15/mahmoud-khalil-free-speech-civil-libertiesBillionaires owning the news:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/katevinton/2016/06/01/these-15-billionaires-own-americas-news-media-companies/https://debatingmatters.com/topic/billionaires-owning-media-companies-is-bad-for-democracy/
https://www.theguardian.com/news/2022/may/03/billionaires-extra-power-media-ownership-elon-musk
https://www.theguardian.com/media/2025/mar/10/washington-post-ruth-marcus-resigns
Censorship on X
https://www.theverge.com/2024/9/4/24235213/x-brazil-suppression-speech-elon-musk-india-turkeyhttps://apnews.com/article/elon-musk-x-influence-uk-us-politics-48cc1870cbdb5df03829f5ab303b579d
https://time.com/6229960/twitter-bans-accounts-elon-musk-impersonators/
Deaths as a result from US
https://www.globalresearch.ca/u-s-regime-has-killed-20-30-million-people-since-world-war-ii/5633111Japan
https://foreignpolicy.com/2005/08/01/think-again-japanese-textbooks/US is not a democracy
https://www.princeton.edu/~mgilens/Gilens homepage materials/Inequality and Democratic Resp/Gilens 2005https://act.represent.us/sign/the-problem-tmp
https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-echochambers-27074746
UK arrests for zoom call
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/article/2024/jul/19/protest-democracy-labour-tories-lawsChina whole process people’s democracy”
https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202403/1308491.shtmlChinese democratic perception
https://www.allianceofdemocracies.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/05/DPI-2024.pdfChinese satisfaction with their government
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2020/07/long-term-survey-reveals-chinese-government-satisfaction/Chinese polling of its people
https://bigdatachina.csis.org/governance-by-data-how-chinas-party-state-keeps-its-pulse-on-the-people/12345
https://x.com/RnaudBertrand/status/1869971055206658177https://www.bernama.com/en/news.php?id=2374971
https://english.news.cn/20241221/3c3b96bcf7bd43e7b417ef4fd123e0f2/c.html
https://www.mdpi.com/2071-1050/14/16/9986
State department and Intelligence working directly with US big tech
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/social-media-is-a-tool-of-the-cia-seriously/So you do not consume any media that isn’t from a source you have already deemed to be “trustworthy” ahead of time.
Have you ever heard of the term “information bubble”
How does somebody establish trust with somebody else who refuses to investigate?
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Cupcake here didn’t vet a single thing. You looked at a subscriber count and the title of the video. Please fuck off forever
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Watch the video and find out, dumbass
Tell me why the New York Times is a trustworthy source.
It’s not a “source”
It’s a YouTube video. An opinion. You determine whether that opinion is trustworthy or not by watching the video and seeing if the conclussions he puts forward make sense to you.
Or you can just ignore it and say it isn’t true because it’s not pre approved by the Cia.
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Because surely the new york times have never fabricated evidence or straight up lied before right?
I’m personally sitting in a Hamas control center underneath a hospital with saddam’s weapons of mass destruction, watching footage of the North Vietnamese bombing American ships in the Gulf of Tonkin, and reading a firsthand account of Spanish colonial forces blowing up the USS Maine.
Nah you just sound sinophobic tbh. I doubt you apply this scrutiny to Western countries.
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And yet you still believe the propaganda of your own country
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Didn’t say it was propaganda.
Sounds like he’s receiving gifts in return for positive Chinese propaganda.
I had a youtube account for decades before I started posting anything to it, and guess what: All I post are communist memes!
GASP
My GOD! That can only mean… I’m a Chinese agent holy shit!
They’re talking about the propaganda from your own country
You should be more ashamed of yourself, you’re a perfect representative of the average american
“You’ve got to vet your sources and protect yourself, and this feller looks a little too friendly with them chinese for my liking”
You are exactly the kind of fear-driven peasant brain that would crush village women between rocks because learning to read is clearly witchcraft. You can’t prove it, but it just feels scary somehow, you know?
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Can you give me an example of a source that has proved their trustworthiness? Perhaps some major newspapers that have spent the last two years lying in support of a genocide?
Bro, this is clearly about more than just ethics in journalism or whatever for you. You saw a guy go on a cruise, make some videos about politics (in our current time, no less) and decided, with no evidence, that he is an agent of the CPC, and that anyone who doesnt see that must just not be as saavy as you. This is some 1960s level white paranoia that you’re rationalizing behind a thin screen of “I’m just practicing media scrutiny”.
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Someone with literal 0 credibility is still more credible than western media outlets, due to their negative credibility.
You have to tell yourself this is what I’m saying because even a cursory examination of your own feelings and motives would show your actual position ("this nobody is clearly a chinese spy, do not believe their lies, why does nobody else understand the very specifically chinese danger here) to be one based in imperial fearmongering. I fully expect you to be reporting neighbors to ICE within a couple years at this rate. Like I said, this is clearly about more than media literacy for you: it’s about China.
I notice you still haven’t been able to name a single reputable news source
You don’t need a reputation to present verifiable facts, try watching the video
Is China in the room with us right now?
“Agent Knowwaynohow, we have a mission of the upmost importance. We’re losing our battle against Liberal Democracy and we need your help. Take your youtube channel with less than 1200 views per video and start posting pro-China videos. This way we can combat the might of CNN, MSNBC, Fox News, OAN, Sky, NYT, Wapo, BBC, The Guardian, basically all of Western Media. Sure it’s a multibillion dollar industry that spans the globe but we can beat it when you get 30k subscribers and your top video has 400k views. For your hard work on this we will pay you…with a cruise?”
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I’m not following…
Should be the name of your biography.
oh shit
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what part of it is untrue
Propaganda isn’t always lies.
Fyi propaganda can be factually correct, calling something propaganda does fuck all to prove it wrong
It’s an .ml post.
check out another amazing insight from lemmy.world everybody
Nick, sorry to hear about your brain worms, get well soon.
it’s terminal
Many such cases.
No thanks I dont need the government controlling the information i consume.
The US corporate-survellance state already does. If you’re living in New Zealand, according to here, your country’s entire social media infrastructure is US owned and controlled.
This is completely different. Even though there are big US websites we’re still free to travel to any site on the web. Thats not the case in China.
Well yeah the megacorpos are already doing that, unregulated by the government
We totally love them for it. /s
if you’re from new zealand you should beg for a policy like this so new zealand could develop its own privately owned social media, instead of relying on American tech oligarchs. it makes absolutely no sense for someone outside of the US, which has its social media market completely dominated by US tech companies, to complain about this.
Exactly. What the fuck is wrong with everyone in this thread?
Doesn’t matter if China is doing it, doesn’t matter if the US is doing it. Censorship is evil. Full stop.
You might not need that but the US has spent the last several years proving conclusively that some people absolutely fucking do need someone controlling the information they consume
The US government already does that. It controls US based social media. If you don’t live in the US you should want your government to control the social media you use because at least that way you can have a say in that control via the (nominally) democratic control you exert over your own government. Either way someone controls it. By not having digital sovereignty your country is just handing the control over your information space to a foreign government which can then use it to shape your opinions and views to their advantage instead of yours.
Okay? So? Still doesn’t justify censorship, no matter what country is doing it. A free and neutral net is crucial, no matter where you’re from.
There is no such thing as a “free and neutral net”. It would be nice if there were but sadly that’s just a fairly tale for children. Someone is always in control.
Yes obviously. If not governments, then Google, Meta, etc. are controlling the narrative. Doesn’t mean we should give up and just let them. China is no less evil than the US, or the big corporations that control us all. Don’t give up and give in to any of them. Resist until the day you die.
A free and neutral net is crucial
If you allow nazis, zionists and other reactionary ideals to roam free, that’s not neutrality, that’s being complicit. It’s siding with the oppressors. The very idea of neutrality is just centrist thinking, that is, a fantasy.
Because of this supposed “neutrality” that you have places like 4chan that are infested with nazi/fascists.
“the ability to control information flow”
Yay! What a feature! Tell me what I’m allowed to know, O lord.
You’re allowed to know that bleach can’t cure covid
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How does that make the great firewall a good thing?
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Keep deepthroating that boot.
Said the one defending the empire, lol
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Well, you’re wrong. Censorship is a tool like any other. If you censor nazis, is that wrong? I don’t think so.
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It only seemed that way because we were not as aware of the extent of western information warfare operations. In reality the firewall has always been justified.
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Finally watched this, it’s very good, highly recommend it.
🙄🙄🙄
Also in my all feed from a hexbear com.
correct - if they didn’t do this they would’ve left themselves open to western tech companies basically monopolizing digital infrastructure with little recourse for chinese tech firms to stand on their own feet.
much less the fact that the western tech firms are 24 government agencies wearing a layer of VC money
All the tankie propaganda reels are bringing all the brainwashed cccpc bots out in hordes arent they?
most of the comments seem to be from hexbear or lemmygrad and i wonder if anyone in the big instances can see any of it since they’ve defederated/banned both.
No or else it’d be a bigger bloodbath in here
yeah, it’s definately odd not a single mention of tiannamen nor the uiyghurs; where it’s usually it’s an overwhelmingly dominant parade of liberals doubling down on their ignorance as proof of authoritarianism.
Got a Uygers, no Tiannamen
only one?
they must be slacking. lol
They went with Pollution instead cause they don’t get how statistics work.
Uyghurs have been mentioned, don’t worry lol
i still don’t see it and i wonder if it’s indicative that those anti-tankie block lists the liberal lemmings are passing among each other are working.
You’re not seeing it because the person who posted it deleted their account lmao
beep boop
china mention = me immediately entering the battlefield
I see non-Chinese criticism of the Chinese controlled internet centered more around control of domestic information than I do about preventing the foreign garbage. We hear a lot about Chinese netizens having ing to use coded language to discuss topics like criticism of leadership, or concern about social issues, or their contributions as will be removed.
Western internet is full of crap, and manipulation, but you won’t get censored for criticising the Government… I guess unless you are an American criticizing Israel (which is a newer thing, really.)
but you won’t get censored for criticising the Government…
You absolutely will. The fact that the censership will be carried through the proxy of a private media conglomerate doesn’t change the end result.
you won’t get censored for criticising the Government… I guess unless you are an American criticizing Israel (which is a newer thing, really.)
This is a pretty big “you won’t get censored… unless you do.”
And if we’re inputting government censorship onto modding decisions by major social media – which we absolutely should, as those companies are ran by a revolving door of politicos, all the owners openly play high-level politics, and the threat of regulation is ever-present – there’s all sorts of criticism of the U.S. government and its approved narratives that will get comments removed or accounts banned.
Lots of politics but you won’t get pulled for calling Donnie a moron, nor for calling Joe a demented crank. Try seriously criticizing the CCP on Weibo.
Calling someone a moron is not seriously criticizing them. It’s impotent shouting, which is why it’s tolerated.
And if we’re going to get into the finer points of what domestic criticism is or isn’t tolerated in China, we’ll need some evidence.
OH YEAH BUT CAN YOU HAVE AN PUBLIC, CACHED ON MULTIPLE PUBLIC SERVERS, EXTREMELY ANTI-SOCIAL, EMOTIONAL OVER REACTION AGAINST A POLITICIAN ON CHINESE INTERNET???
I have freely made history today by posting slurs into the public record. The SEE SEE PEE will never give its citizens the ability to do this.
mfs will post this calling it “freedom” or “political participation” or “democracy”.
calling Donnie a moron, nor for calling Joe a demented crank.
“Serious critism”
The US government banned tiktok for the explicit purpose of censoring information about the holocaust they’re committing in Gaza
Western internet is full of crap, and manipulation, but you won’t get censored for criticising the Government… I guess unless you are an American criticizing Israel (which is a newer thing, really.)
Isn’t that why feddit.org only allows criticism of the occupation regime of west palestine if you precede it with “Israel has a right to defend itself”? At least they claim they fear governmental retribution
Not sure who you would blame for feddit blocking that ME topic, but you can criticize anything else that you want now.
“That ME topic” is a full-blown genocide and fuck you for trying to hide it behind some nicer sounding phrase.
I am blaming the g*rman government for their draconian crackdown on anti-genocide propaganda but also the mods for giving in a priori! Like nothing had even happened and they’re already self-censoring. So I don’t know why you’re saying “Aside from that bit of genocidal censorship, you can talk about anything else”, because that censorhip of genocide is not going to be the end.
Also “you can criticise anything else” is wrong, because if you’re critical of their lack of evidence for what they claim to be an “Uyghur genocide” you get pretty much insta-banned. But thats not due to the government rather than the feddit mods marinating themselves in NED propaganda and not interacting with anything outside their information bubble.
The self censorship that exists on the Chinese internet is a matter of moderation scale and techniques. It doesn’t exist in the West because Western companies have the incentive to keep you interacting with their products.
In China moderation is meant to:
- Protect the rest of the users from bad behavior
- Signal to the bad user that they are engaging in bad behavior.
Western moderation is meant to:
- Protect the rest of users from a bad behavior
- Keep bad users engaged in order to drive ad revenues.
1 and 2 are inherently at tensions with one another. Thus you have the problem where 1 is diluted by 2 leading to a much more limited set of what is considered bad, and an ever changing and political understanding of it based on the whims of the ownership and their relation to the party in power. Facebook changes its moderation policies based on presidential administration.
2 also leads to non-deterministic systems of gating users into fake interaction or limiting their reach to other similarly bad users.
Another reason is cultural / social. Praise is often used ironicly in China, they have a very fine line between legitimate praise and what in the West would be considered saccharine or gassing someone up. In China when you overly praise someone it’s read as a criticism of the person for what you’re praising them for. So typically censorship structures do not take into account sentiment unlike in the West esp. because Chinese is more of a figurative language than English. There is a lot of context lost in communicating text only and audio only Chinese due to how the language is constructed. In essence they prefer to police topic not types of speech (e.g. hate speech, criticism, etc).
The last reason this happens is a lot of the Chinese Internet’s moderation policies are based on the fact that their level of public social acceptability is much more constricted think PG not even PG-13. In that sense the codified language works to create a space where you’re able to have conversations on things that would “rock the boat” without getting everyone hot and bothered. Unlike the Western Internet where social media companies want these clashes to happen because they drive more engagement and thus more revenue.
For example instead of posting about censorship and getting into an internet pile on where nothing happens and nobody learns anything because they’re talking past each-other why not just post a picture of a river crab wearing 3 watches. Anyone who cares knows what that means and they know that arguing about it online isn’t actually the way to change anything in China. Everyone having a take while barely understanding the thing they have a take on is only beneficial to Western capitalists running internet companies that act as treats. Higher education is affordable in China, you can actually go learn about censorship at an accredited program. Surprisingly because Chinese citizens on average are protected by their government from being wrung dry for all their profit potential by their capitalist class they have time/energy to do these things.
I have never been in China, so I can’t pretend to have certainty on the topic.
It seems naive to believe that the Chinese firewall acts purely as a benign protector of the assaulted Chinese citizen. Chinese people are not like stupid children in need of protection, they are smart and strong.
It seems naive to believe that the Chinese firewall acts purely as a benign protector of the assaulted Chinese citizen. Chinese people are not like stupid children in need of protection, they are smart and strong.
Yeah it’s equally naive to believe that the Chinese firewall acts purely as a hostile censor, Chinese people aren’t uneducated, oppressed, impoverished individuals, they are accomplished, politically active, and well to do. The Chinese people have comparatively derived a larger individual and collective benefit from their government than Americans have in the last 50 years.
If you read actual comparisons of “censorship regimes” there are tons of commonalities that are just ignored by Westerners and their Chinese counterparts are made out to be uniquely evil and beyond the pale. For every news article you read about how the National Security Police invites a satirist to “drink tea” you’re ignoring all of the times the FBI does the exact same thing, and uses various psychological tactics to escalate into a position of legal authority to get around their limited authority to collect evidence.
You know why it’s “soooo hard” for the cops to arrest rich people even if they know where they are? It’s because the tactic of escalatory arrest (an arrest that happens without a warrant as the result of an “investigation”) doesn’t work on rich people, they have gates, intercoms, staff, and know their rights. They aren’t easily cajoled into the position of opening their home to a cop, or allowing a cop access to their body. Isn’t is very strange that these very technical legal distinctions aren’t told explicitly to the “freedom loving people” of America? Meanwhile the agents of “evil Chinese government” don’t need to play games like this, because the cards are all on the table.
People in other countries get “dissapeared”, but when ICE or the Department of Corrections shuffles prisoners around for political purposes such as Mahmoud Khalil. People in other countries are “political prisoners” but in America we have the WGAD which is a nice rhetorical trick so that the government can “honestly label” it’s political prisoners (upon a opaque and deliberatley difficult review process only undertaken by those who actually want to go through it for the benefit of being labeled a political prisoner. WGAD has not authority to enforce anything.
People in other countries get thrown in jail because of political corruption, in the US saying such a thing is insulting the honor of the judiciary as a whole, a judiciary that allows the same practices the jailed Stephen Donzinger for the crime of taking on a legal case against Chevron in Ecuador. Furthermore it’s processes are abused to provide legal procedural punishments for missteps in engaging with the system such as the contempt charges the Donzinger case. Donzinger is still disbarred and cannot leave the country, despite winning all of his appeals. All at the behest of a corporation that doesn’t want to create a precedent that it must pay for poisoning people.
The reality here is that you’re not actively comparing things, you are just going on hunches or whims, and if you take a look that’s how a lot of information you receive is actually structured. That is what allows labels like “authoritarian” to have a spooky evil weight. In essence the US has simplify codified the abuse into law, which is how it gets around these icky little moments of “Are we the baddies?” the reply is a thought terminating cliche of “No we’re all just following legal orders, in the freest country in the World”. China doesn’t need to Nuremburg because it’s goal of social cohesion ensures that people understand how and why things are happening to them.
You? I like you.
but you won’t get censored for criticising the Government… I guess unless you are an American criticizing Israel
Or if you are a British journalist speaking out against genocide, in which case you get arrested on terrorism charges
Or if you are in Germany and hold a conference discussing said genocide, in which case the police raids you and shuts you down
Or if you are a European journalist documenting an inconvenient truth from the “wrong side”, in which case you get your bank account seized and face criminal charges and are banned from entering the EU
Or if you are in the Baltics celebrating Europe’s victory over the Nazis and singing songs the government doesn’t like, in which case you get arrested, fined and possibly jailed
Freedom of speech in the West amounts to you being free to shout into the void, and only so long as it doesn’t change anything or threaten the ruling establishment and its political agenda. As long as your speech is entirely ineffectual and can be ignored by those in power then you can scream as loud as you want. As soon as your speech is a real threat to the agenda of the ruling class you are quickly shut down and made an example of with extreme prejudice.
You are functionally not allowed to challenge the official government position in the West either. In European countries the government outright bans candidates from standing in elections if they are anti-EU or anti-NATO, and you are threatened with fines or even jail time for disagreeing with the official narrative on Ukraine conflict. On certain issues, namely those that actually matter, there is only one accepted position, and deviation results in you being branded a terrorist, traitor, Hamas sympathizer, Russian agent, etc.
The West is just as if not more authoritarian than China. China is just more honest about their censorship.
Your German example is legit, but you are completely dismissing their cultural guilt related to WWII; there are signs of them shifting. Your Balics example show possible Goverent overreach, but you are completely dismissing the existential threat of Russia.
You are also trying to be subtle in shifting to mainstream media, when the thread was about internet control and social media.
You are playing very loose with context. There are reasons to distrust all the Governments, which is why an uncensored internet is of value.
Your German example is legit, but you are completely dismissing their cultural guilt related to WWII; there are signs of them shifting.
They have no guilt, else they would not be supporting another genocide or giving money and weapons to help Nazis kill Russians again. Their pretense of feeling guilt is purely performative and self-aggrandizing. The only signs are of them getting worse, more self-righteous, more racist, more authoritarian toward any dissenters, more detached from reality.
but you are completely dismissing the existential threat of Russia.
Is their deranged paranoia supposed to justify their revisionist history portraying SS butchers as the good guys and the liberators of the death camps as the bad guys?
You are also trying to be subtle in shifting to mainstream media
Where have i mentioned mainstream media? And why are you shifting the goalposts? The topic was freedom of speech, regardless on which media. And social media has replaced mainstream media for most people nowadays anyway.
when the thread was about internet control and social media
Yes, social media is being censored and controlled across Europe and the broader West. Let’s not even mention how often Facebook, YouTube, or Twitter have banned anti-imperialist channels, deleted pro-Palestinian or pro-Russian content. The governments themselves are legally persecuting social media based news outlets, forcing them to shut down
Both in Britain and in Germany you can get arrested and prosecuted for social media posts. There have been plenty such cases.
In Germany you get sued and even arrested for simply insulting politicians on social media. It is enough to simply call a politician stupid (what else can you call someone who doesn’t know what doing a 360° turn means?) and you can get charged and taken to court. One particularly ghoulish politician has levied over 2000 defamation charges at people for insulting her.
Help Nazis kill Russians? Wtf… I thought you would mentiom Israel as those are literal Nazis but Ukraine literally got hit with huge Propaganda since 2014 and just got attacked by Russia.
Why the fuck should a country being attacked also be the offender and Nazi?
Did Russians flee from their countries because they got attacked by Ukraine? No, they left because the countries leader arrests you or puts you on the battlefield without caring if you are disabled, as disabled people got this letter too (but I believe they corrected that issue). Ukraine people also don’t nearly look like Nazis when I see them in my country and their stories also dont allign with the Russian Propaganda. I mean, with both Russians and Ukraines I can talk face to face and see real opinion.
In WWII, Nazis did attack other countries and started to tell their everyone they got attacked first… oh, wait… didnt Putin do that? Holy shot just do your own non-biased research without being an instant love fanboy of any authoritarian country. (China is still somewhat cool)
Did Russians flee from their countries because they got attacked by Ukraine?
Yes those who speak russian in ukraine (many in eastern ukraine) had to flee
Ukraine people also don’t nearly look like Nazis when I see them in my country
Those are ones that had to flee from the nazis probably
didnt Putin do that?
No, nuland did that
Damn, you really are not interested in really understanding the first message. I meant Russians from Russia. Seems like you doge topics that speek against your fandom.
You’re such a troll lol
You got me, I guess. Of course I understand liberalspeak, even if I hate it.
I wish they wouldn’t talk in that weaselly liar way, its mentally taxing to constantly have to interpret their cowardly attempts at hiding their inner white supremacist into english.
The Nazi regime in Kiev which came to power in a US orchestrated coup attacked Russian speaking regions of Ukraine and has pursued a policy of ethnic cleansing since 2014. Sources here: https://lemmy.ml/post/26654686
I tried to follow the sources but even the sources just lack so many things to be trustworthy at all.
Your Balics example show possible Goverent overreach, but you are completely dismissing the existential threat of Russia.
This is you abandoning your own values the moment someone in authority tells you there’s an implacable horde of scary foreigners who we can’t beat without taking away your rights.
So you’re just Motte and Bailying from “the West doesn’t censer criticism” to “our censership is justified! How can you expect Germany not to suppress critism of genocide, don’t you know that they did the holocaust?”
which is why an uncensored internet is of value.
Great, tell me when you find one
So censorship is bad unless it’s good. Got it.
You are playing very loose with context. There are reasons to distrust all the Governments, which is why an uncensored internet is of value.
Yeah so your argument boils down to it’s okay to dismiss the Chinese context because they’re categorically evil, but the Western governments have “good reasons” because they’re categorically good.
Surprise surprise it’s just chauvinism.
If you guys are so sure youre right about stuff why do you delete people’s messages you disagree with? It just makes reading the thread later on annoying lol
Most were deleted by creator, a handful were removed by mod for good reason.
Press ctrl+f and search for “removed by mod” and “deleted by creator” in this thread. There’s 4 of the former, and 41 of the latter.
Mods just need to remove the blatantly fascist/racist shit, the rest of them will can just be bullied into deleting their comments lol
You mean blinx? They deleted their own account, of their own accord.
Nobody is deleting their comments aside from one removal by a mod, most of the deleted comments are from one of you racist libs getting bodied by sources and people that know what they are talking about and so deleted their account out of cowardice.
Like can you even read? It literally says deleted by creator
All of the ones I see here just say deleted bro lmao
Then that is your app. Most of the missing comments are from users deleting their own bullshit.
Also I am not a bro.
Bros are usually chill so that checks out
Go fuck yourself.
Rawr
If it’s cool with everyone here, I’m just going to spend the next eight hours getting extremely mad with people on the Internet over my refusal to watch a 40 minute video essay on YouTube, or read literally anything.
As is tradition.
It’s not only your right, but your patriotic duty
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