Honestly, if the combination of AI porn + good AR + haptic fleshlights gets us to a point where horny single men with limited real-world romantic prospects can have fulfilling sex lives without having to bug any actual living women to attain them, I think the world will be a better place.
Yeah, but with the caveat that this will only make the world a better place if society chose to implicitly allow this, and actively chose not to disparage, mock, and exclude those people who want to go this path. Which, based on everything we’ve ever seen about society, is not going to happen.
True, but people already do 80% of that - I don’t think the stigma attached to “AI-generated porn that talks to you and responds to your requests” is likely to be meaningfully greater than the stigma attached to regular porn, or to an OnlyFans where you’re doing the same thing with an actual woman but clamoring for her attention with a bunch of other guys.
Yea… yea but that’s not what you said. You implicitly said “strapped to AI powered AR with a fleshlight” or some nonsense like that. And then when called out about how that would not work societally - you then default to “there’s no stigma with regular porn”.
People already do watch AR porn. People already do use interactive fleshlights. People already do talk to and make requests of performers on OnlyFans and lots of other places. None of these things seem to come with much more stigma than regular porn; I don’t think the use of AI changes that.
Y’all probably would love this utopia. Socially inept legions of men ostracized from society jacking off in their mothers basement with AR / AI till the end of time.
Question is why? And why when this article is talking about James Dean?
Who are you that are so fast du judge people you barely know? I have a good job, functioning social life and am generally considered a pleasent person to spend time with. Yet i choose to not date. The reasons are quite complex and none of anyones business. Why and how does watching AI porn make me a socially inept person jacking it in some basement? Maybe it is time to get off your high horse and use reason in your arguments instead of emotions and sterotypes.
Your a fucking idiot. I’m on your side. I was responding to a comment saying that that’s a good thing. Perhaps it is for you and that’s fine, jack off in your mother’s basement then for all I give a shit.
Normalizing this behavior is not healthy for anyone but I also don’t believe in ostracizing it.
Uh, based on the realistic fuck robots that are hitting the market I don’t think you have to worry about society telling you that you can’t have VR sex with a giant hentai squid with massive tits. Just maybe don’t do it in your parents living room this time.
I don’t follow at all. When you do sexual activities in a public area you are making other people part of the act, without their consent. Do what you want with consenting people.
If you don’t want people to kink shame don’t expose them to your kink. I am not knocking on doors telling people what they should or should not do, I am asking not to be part of their activities. The vast majority of people have my attitude towards this.
We’re talking about AI porn in this thread. I’m not sure why you’re going off on a rant about exhibitionism, or why you’re doing it here in a reply to my comment.
Your comment was in reply to a comment talking about sex robots. Your comment was calling that comment out for being discriminatory against people who use sex robots openly. It was all very easy to follow as an observer. Conversations wander sometimes.
I mean… its not like masturbation isnt already mocked and shamed already around the world, its not like thats ever stoped the more perverted ones that have weird kinks. And even if theres legislations against it (which there hasnt been any serious one afak since the middle ages) the wankers are always gonna win, probably because they have more stamina.
Edit: now im not saying they should be legislated, imho the government has no bussines on ones sex life as long as all parts involved are concenting adults or being solo, just that they always have and probably will be shamed, why? I dont know, but probably religion has something to do there. I wont judge anybody though.
Is it, feels like Gen X and Millenials were fairly sex positive generations that quite happily talked about things like that and porn. Gen Z seem to be scarily sex-negative again, see all their complaints about sex scenes in films as an example.
I said around the world. First world countries thend to be more outgoing with sex discucion (not necesarilly thr same as education) than other countries that in the most part, or at least on the rulling classes, thend to be more traditional. Althought about the whole gen z and gen x thing, this is the first time i heard of that, could you elaborate on that m8?
Theres been a lot of chatter about the sex and nudity in Oppenheimer recently and whether it was “necessary for the plot” which it clearly was as those scenes are packed with character building.
Yeah sure Gen Z is all sex-negatice when they grow up and all they ever hear (from teachers, moral authorities etc…) is how egoistic they are for desiring sex. What child in a sane mind is willing to effort so much energy just to overcome the needless and worthless obstacle that is general morality to have sex with someone?
True, but my scope was more focused to someone thats gonna treat themselves to a vr suported oppaibot2100, with many features including blah blah blah. You get the drill, the opaibot is getting a diferent drill in another way though.
Meh. If someone wants to opt out they pretty much are going to do it. Besides would you rather deal with them? Imagine if everyone you were around didn’t have a means to entertain themselves at all times. They would be engaged, they would create drama, they would tell other people what they thought of them.
Sometimes in industrial equipment we put in random alarms to be triggered so the people who are supposed to stand there have to do something vs wandering around causing trouble. Especially in union plants.
Well, to rule out the “misanthropic” part one doesn’t really need to have a fulfilling sex life, just meet a few people (suppose, women) who’d make them like humanity again.
About disengaged and disinterested - it’s more about engagement and interest being hard.
These men used to gather on the streets and start breaking shit and kicking grannies back in the day to express their frustration. Them withdrawing to their moms basements smoking weed and jerking off to porn might not be ideal but perhaps not the worst thing either. That’s why we don’t see a significant uptick in crime despite the ever increasing amount of such men.
I remember a guy on reddit a few years ago arguing vehemently that their hand was better than an actual living woman’s vagina, to say nothing of a Fleshlight.
The denial was strong in that individual’s case, but if enough incels are already in that deep it’s probably gonna be enough for many of them.
Except instead they will treat ai girls as filthy as they want and then expect all women to act like that. Then not understand why they don’t… yeah pretty sure that’s what’s going to happen.
Makes sense. I grew up playing videogames where I would shot stuff that was in my way. That is why in real life I use a gun to get thru traffic. I also played a game for a while where I rode on the back of a lizard and ate mushrooms to grow larger. Which is pretty much my typical weekday.
For you see I have not hit the level of mental development of most 3 year olds and can not separate our playtime from the real world. Just like the hypothetical people in your example.
Now if you excuse me I plan to make bricks vanish by arranging them in a straight line wall-to-wall in my house.
Without question. The ability to have sex with something isn’t going to prevent them from being socially dysfunctional and would, if anything, make it noticeably worse. You’re getting off, but you still have issues talking to the other sex. They’re just easier to avoid addressing now and your dolls don’t demand basic respect.
I don’t think I’d come out too much against it, personally. People got biological imperatives, I’m not gonna protest against dildos. But the financial and mental health crises both remain and can’t be circumvented like that.
I’m already having the mental health crisis, would be nice to have the immersive VR porn to go with it tbh. People in this thread are mostly talking about incels but, like, there’s many men with horrible social issues who are self aware. I don’t have a relationship, I think I would be a terrible partner and me being single is for the best. I still am lonely sometimes, but accepting it and moving on helps a lot. It still would be nice to have something like this because I would be able to have some companionship without having to be in someone else’s life.
Before anyone tells me to go to therapy, I had a few sessions and then my therapist went on long term sick leave and I don’t think I have the strength to try again. It hurts less to just accept and live with my problems.
Because they will get frustrated when they realize real women are not exactly like their perfect, idealized AI counterparts, that they have their own individual personalities, and are not beholden to their men like an AI girlfriend would.
“Real” women are already and have been rocking instagram filters or photoshop for a while now. Deception isn’t limited to AI. Should breast implants be banned too?
I downvoted not because (as the top reply says) this is how it happens already, but because healthy communication is a cornerstone in every healthy relationship.
Your argument that men are unable to separate the fabricated from reality is insulting,
I do not dismiss we are barely out of the dark ages, but (mostly) we aren’t cave men.
I wasn’t generalizing that men can’t separate the fabricated from reality. I’m saying the fringe and extreme side of the people who would indulge in tech like that would. There are already incels who are like that to women with just the existence of 2D girls. You think it will change for the better if they upgrade to a 3D version complete with physical devices and haptic feedback? Sure maybe, if they keep to their own world. But these people are also online and interact with real human beings too. Obviously the level-headed people won’t be that way, even with the existence and use of those kind of devices. Don’t generalize.
I agree, but as I also mentioned in another reply - those people will eventually interact with real human beings one way or another. It’s not about them pursuing women, but how they will treat them in real life. Of course it won’t be everyone, most people will be able to keep that to themselves, but there will always be the fringe end of the spectrum that can’t help themselves.
I’d push back on that and say that’s fear mongering. The scenario you’re describing MAY occur IF “they” don’t witness social interactions with IRL girls at all, and that includes video/virtual meetups, video recordings of IRL girls interacting etc.
“They” would have to have never seen a female person in any media other than their AI sexbots, which I find incredibly unlikely that this could become the norm.
I don’t see how. It is just porn but more specific. You could get the same results before this but with a tiny bit more work. It should have as much impact on humanity as did on-demand streaming did. On the individual level this could maybe put an end to all the not-so-ethically produced porn.
Impacting the plebeian workforce in a way that’s felt even harder than today’s inability to afford kids? Yeah, this is gonna be mocked and regulated out of existence for sure.
It’ll look like moral reasoning, but the fewer workers exist, the more bargaining power all of them have against the rich. See the scarcity of laborers during the black plague triggering the end of feudalism.
“People in rich, heavily resource-consuming countries should have fewer babies” is a hellscape take now? Have you read literally any news article this summer?
Welp we all know you’re eating steak in the Matrix.
AI porn is interesting for its extreme detail in systems that were not quite designed for it, and what has been achieved with extremely small model sizes. Like a typical chat model of what seems like an equivalent quality as far as accurate detail comprehension is two to three times larger. It is hard to objectively compare these two, but this is my intuitive/highly speculative opinion.
That said, in is hilarious how much some model checkpoints can troll someone. Let’s just say, after my casual experiments to explore how LoRAs and other modifications and enhancements work, there would be many PTSD experiences for anyone that tries this. You might just find yourself reorienting your preferences every time you blink.
Also, if the option is available, you run the serious risk of it becoming an alternative lifestyle, especially amongst those that pursue an academic path and must stay free from distraction. If this is experienced at a younger age, it may remain as a permanent choice. It objectifies relationships and that may prove difficult to change.
I think you will find the only barrier to relationships is really the person in question’s state of mind and willingness to put in effort. If a skateboard has aspirations to board a hundred million dollar super yacht, that’s a mental health issue. However, outside of mismanaged birth policies where the sexes are disproportionately represented, I’m a strong believer that there is a skateboard for every skateboard, and at least a dock and dingy for every super yacht.
The complete opposite is true. That would be a death of dispar filled distopia. Do we not have enough virgins jacking to internet porn all day with crippling depression.
People need relationships not better internet porn
Honestly, if the combination of AI porn + good AR + haptic fleshlights gets us to a point where horny single men with limited real-world romantic prospects can have fulfilling sex lives without having to bug any actual living women to attain them, I think the world will be a better place.
Yeah, but with the caveat that this will only make the world a better place if society chose to implicitly allow this, and actively chose not to disparage, mock, and exclude those people who want to go this path. Which, based on everything we’ve ever seen about society, is not going to happen.
True, but people already do 80% of that - I don’t think the stigma attached to “AI-generated porn that talks to you and responds to your requests” is likely to be meaningfully greater than the stigma attached to regular porn, or to an OnlyFans where you’re doing the same thing with an actual woman but clamoring for her attention with a bunch of other guys.
Yea… yea but that’s not what you said. You implicitly said “strapped to AI powered AR with a fleshlight” or some nonsense like that. And then when called out about how that would not work societally - you then default to “there’s no stigma with regular porn”.
🙄
People already do watch AR porn. People already do use interactive fleshlights. People already do talk to and make requests of performers on OnlyFans and lots of other places. None of these things seem to come with much more stigma than regular porn; I don’t think the use of AI changes that.
Y’all probably would love this utopia. Socially inept legions of men ostracized from society jacking off in their mothers basement with AR / AI till the end of time.
Question is why? And why when this article is talking about James Dean?
Who are you that are so fast du judge people you barely know? I have a good job, functioning social life and am generally considered a pleasent person to spend time with. Yet i choose to not date. The reasons are quite complex and none of anyones business. Why and how does watching AI porn make me a socially inept person jacking it in some basement? Maybe it is time to get off your high horse and use reason in your arguments instead of emotions and sterotypes.
Your a fucking idiot. I’m on your side. I was responding to a comment saying that that’s a good thing. Perhaps it is for you and that’s fine, jack off in your mother’s basement then for all I give a shit.
Normalizing this behavior is not healthy for anyone but I also don’t believe in ostracizing it.
Called out about what? What gotcha did you find?
Uh, based on the realistic fuck robots that are hitting the market I don’t think you have to worry about society telling you that you can’t have VR sex with a giant hentai squid with massive tits. Just maybe don’t do it in your parents living room this time.
See? This is what I mean.
I don’t follow at all. When you do sexual activities in a public area you are making other people part of the act, without their consent. Do what you want with consenting people.
If you don’t want people to kink shame don’t expose them to your kink. I am not knocking on doors telling people what they should or should not do, I am asking not to be part of their activities. The vast majority of people have my attitude towards this.
We’re talking about AI porn in this thread. I’m not sure why you’re going off on a rant about exhibitionism, or why you’re doing it here in a reply to my comment.
Your comment was in reply to a comment talking about sex robots. Your comment was calling that comment out for being discriminatory against people who use sex robots openly. It was all very easy to follow as an observer. Conversations wander sometimes.
I mean it’s just common sense not to do these things in your mother’s living room my guy.
Couldn’t have said it better myself.
I mean… its not like masturbation isnt already mocked and shamed already around the world, its not like thats ever stoped the more perverted ones that have weird kinks. And even if theres legislations against it (which there hasnt been any serious one afak since the middle ages) the wankers are always gonna win, probably because they have more stamina.
Edit: now im not saying they should be legislated, imho the government has no bussines on ones sex life as long as all parts involved are concenting adults or being solo, just that they always have and probably will be shamed, why? I dont know, but probably religion has something to do there. I wont judge anybody though.
Is it, feels like Gen X and Millenials were fairly sex positive generations that quite happily talked about things like that and porn. Gen Z seem to be scarily sex-negative again, see all their complaints about sex scenes in films as an example.
I said around the world. First world countries thend to be more outgoing with sex discucion (not necesarilly thr same as education) than other countries that in the most part, or at least on the rulling classes, thend to be more traditional. Althought about the whole gen z and gen x thing, this is the first time i heard of that, could you elaborate on that m8?
https://www.newsweek.com/gen-z-distate-hollywood-sex-scenes-sparks-censorship-debate-1782040
Theres been a lot of chatter about the sex and nudity in Oppenheimer recently and whether it was “necessary for the plot” which it clearly was as those scenes are packed with character building.
I don’t keep up on zoomerisms, is this really a thing? I thought zoomers were basically the OnlyFans generation.
https://www.newsweek.com/gen-z-distate-hollywood-sex-scenes-sparks-censorship-debate-1782040
This entire sentence is it’s own reflective meme.
Yeah sure Gen Z is all sex-negatice when they grow up and all they ever hear (from teachers, moral authorities etc…) is how egoistic they are for desiring sex. What child in a sane mind is willing to effort so much energy just to overcome the needless and worthless obstacle that is general morality to have sex with someone?
Is that what they’re being told? Doesn’t seem like it would be when their teachers, parents, etc will be from sex positive generations?
My experience at least.
I’m not sure “pervert” is the best word to describe someone who masturbates.
True, but my scope was more focused to someone thats gonna treat themselves to a vr suported oppaibot2100, with many features including blah blah blah. You get the drill, the opaibot is getting a diferent drill in another way though.
Because what the world needs now is an even more disengaged, disinterested, and misanthropic portion of the population.
Why learn to fuck people when you can just buy The Wanker 9000™?
Better wait for the 9001, you don’t want to be a first adopter on this sort of thing.
Instructions unclear, dick stuck in toaster.
Send help.
“We’re sorry to announce a product recall due to a low to moderate chance of your device performing an unexpected castration.”
Just flip the switch
deleted by creator
Meh. If someone wants to opt out they pretty much are going to do it. Besides would you rather deal with them? Imagine if everyone you were around didn’t have a means to entertain themselves at all times. They would be engaged, they would create drama, they would tell other people what they thought of them.
Sometimes in industrial equipment we put in random alarms to be triggered so the people who are supposed to stand there have to do something vs wandering around causing trouble. Especially in union plants.
Well, to rule out the “misanthropic” part one doesn’t really need to have a fulfilling sex life, just meet a few people (suppose, women) who’d make them like humanity again.
About disengaged and disinterested - it’s more about engagement and interest being hard.
These men used to gather on the streets and start breaking shit and kicking grannies back in the day to express their frustration. Them withdrawing to their moms basements smoking weed and jerking off to porn might not be ideal but perhaps not the worst thing either. That’s why we don’t see a significant uptick in crime despite the ever increasing amount of such men.
Yeah let’s just give young men sex robots and make them even more detached from community and relationships
I do kind of wonder what the end-game is in terms of fertility rates in society if we can manufacture ever-more-perfect simulations of sex.
The Amish might still be around, but…
lmao that is not fulfilling
Some might think so.
I remember a guy on reddit a few years ago arguing vehemently that their hand was better than an actual living woman’s vagina, to say nothing of a Fleshlight.
The denial was strong in that individual’s case, but if enough incels are already in that deep it’s probably gonna be enough for many of them.
Except instead they will treat ai girls as filthy as they want and then expect all women to act like that. Then not understand why they don’t… yeah pretty sure that’s what’s going to happen.
Just like video games taught me to shoot everything
No it’s much more like the way porn already messes up a lot of men’s perception of women and sex
As disney and romantic movies did with womens idea of relationships
How does AI impact this anymore than real girls? If anything it could cut down on sex trafficking.
Makes sense. I grew up playing videogames where I would shot stuff that was in my way. That is why in real life I use a gun to get thru traffic. I also played a game for a while where I rode on the back of a lizard and ate mushrooms to grow larger. Which is pretty much my typical weekday.
For you see I have not hit the level of mental development of most 3 year olds and can not separate our playtime from the real world. Just like the hypothetical people in your example.
Now if you excuse me I plan to make bricks vanish by arranging them in a straight line wall-to-wall in my house.
Without question. The ability to have sex with something isn’t going to prevent them from being socially dysfunctional and would, if anything, make it noticeably worse. You’re getting off, but you still have issues talking to the other sex. They’re just easier to avoid addressing now and your dolls don’t demand basic respect.
I don’t think I’d come out too much against it, personally. People got biological imperatives, I’m not gonna protest against dildos. But the financial and mental health crises both remain and can’t be circumvented like that.
I’m already having the mental health crisis, would be nice to have the immersive VR porn to go with it tbh. People in this thread are mostly talking about incels but, like, there’s many men with horrible social issues who are self aware. I don’t have a relationship, I think I would be a terrible partner and me being single is for the best. I still am lonely sometimes, but accepting it and moving on helps a lot. It still would be nice to have something like this because I would be able to have some companionship without having to be in someone else’s life.
Before anyone tells me to go to therapy, I had a few sessions and then my therapist went on long term sick leave and I don’t think I have the strength to try again. It hurts less to just accept and live with my problems.
You just described Japan
Why would being sexually fulfilled make men more shitty to women? Perhaps aloof, but that is different from hateful.
Because they will get frustrated when they realize real women are not exactly like their perfect, idealized AI counterparts, that they have their own individual personalities, and are not beholden to their men like an AI girlfriend would.
You got downvoted but this is exactly how porn affects many men already
“Real” women are already and have been rocking instagram filters or photoshop for a while now. Deception isn’t limited to AI. Should breast implants be banned too?
I didn’t say it should be banned, we’re just talking about the problems it might cause.
I downvoted not because (as the top reply says) this is how it happens already, but because healthy communication is a cornerstone in every healthy relationship.
Your argument that men are unable to separate the fabricated from reality is insulting,
I do not dismiss we are barely out of the dark ages, but (mostly) we aren’t cave men.
I wasn’t generalizing that men can’t separate the fabricated from reality. I’m saying the fringe and extreme side of the people who would indulge in tech like that would. There are already incels who are like that to women with just the existence of 2D girls. You think it will change for the better if they upgrade to a 3D version complete with physical devices and haptic feedback? Sure maybe, if they keep to their own world. But these people are also online and interact with real human beings too. Obviously the level-headed people won’t be that way, even with the existence and use of those kind of devices. Don’t generalize.
The whole point is the robot will be satisfying to the point of not pursuing women.
I agree, but as I also mentioned in another reply - those people will eventually interact with real human beings one way or another. It’s not about them pursuing women, but how they will treat them in real life. Of course it won’t be everyone, most people will be able to keep that to themselves, but there will always be the fringe end of the spectrum that can’t help themselves.
Im not sure what your saying, that some people will always suck at dealing with others?
“sexually fulfilled”!
what do you think sexuality is?
This is a strange question. What do you think sexuality is? And what about your definition precludes fulfillment from an AI partner?
ejaculation is not “sexual fulfillment”!
Yes, and drugs aren’t true happiness, and yet they are prescribed.
what the heck does that mean?
It means that, even though it’s not what you’re looking for, it’s still helpful.
I doubt many people will get true fulfillment from VR sex because they know at the end if the day it’s not real
I think you underestimate the human ability to self-delude.
I’d push back on that and say that’s fear mongering. The scenario you’re describing MAY occur IF “they” don’t witness social interactions with IRL girls at all, and that includes video/virtual meetups, video recordings of IRL girls interacting etc.
“They” would have to have never seen a female person in any media other than their AI sexbots, which I find incredibly unlikely that this could become the norm.
Yeah, it’s a great idea, if these people don’t, like, interact with the world writ large
The psychological ramifications of that are immense. It would destroy people. It would be no different than any other drug.
I for one welcome our new sexbot overlords.
I don’t see how. It is just porn but more specific. You could get the same results before this but with a tiny bit more work. It should have as much impact on humanity as did on-demand streaming did. On the individual level this could maybe put an end to all the not-so-ethically produced porn.
lemmy coomers will never concede this obvious point
Maybe because some of us don’t think something should be forbidden for “being like a drug”.
Governments trying to control the private lives of adults never ends well.
I’d argue but I’m too busy cooming
The human reproductive rate will plummet once we can have VR with sensory input.
Future Sex is a great anthology series about it.
I’m cool with this, we need a lot fewer humans anyway and particularly so in countries rich enough for people to be able to afford VR sex rigs.
Impacting the plebeian workforce in a way that’s felt even harder than today’s inability to afford kids? Yeah, this is gonna be mocked and regulated out of existence for sure.
It’ll look like moral reasoning, but the fewer workers exist, the more bargaining power all of them have against the rich. See the scarcity of laborers during the black plague triggering the end of feudalism.
Yes, and also: The labour market is a market, meaning if there is fewer workers available, then “prices” (payment) go up.
It will already start dropping in our lifetime without any way to reverse it. Even African fertility rates are dropping
it isn’t the first world we have to worry about.
Lemmy is actually more of a hellsacape than Reddit
“People in rich, heavily resource-consuming countries should have fewer babies” is a hellscape take now? Have you read literally any news article this summer?
Yes. Yes telling people not to I have babies is a hellscape.you have made my point for me
I had semi-high hopes, but yea, this place is atrocious
More for us then boys
That’s science fiction.
Ahhh, you watched the Red Dwarf episode “Better than Life”
Welp we all know you’re eating steak in the Matrix.
AI porn is interesting for its extreme detail in systems that were not quite designed for it, and what has been achieved with extremely small model sizes. Like a typical chat model of what seems like an equivalent quality as far as accurate detail comprehension is two to three times larger. It is hard to objectively compare these two, but this is my intuitive/highly speculative opinion.
That said, in is hilarious how much some model checkpoints can troll someone. Let’s just say, after my casual experiments to explore how LoRAs and other modifications and enhancements work, there would be many PTSD experiences for anyone that tries this. You might just find yourself reorienting your preferences every time you blink.
Also, if the option is available, you run the serious risk of it becoming an alternative lifestyle, especially amongst those that pursue an academic path and must stay free from distraction. If this is experienced at a younger age, it may remain as a permanent choice. It objectifies relationships and that may prove difficult to change.
I think you will find the only barrier to relationships is really the person in question’s state of mind and willingness to put in effort. If a skateboard has aspirations to board a hundred million dollar super yacht, that’s a mental health issue. However, outside of mismanaged birth policies where the sexes are disproportionately represented, I’m a strong believer that there is a skateboard for every skateboard, and at least a dock and dingy for every super yacht.
wtf did I just read.
Depends if you are into tech, skateboarding, or yachting
The birth rate is low enough already
The complete opposite is true. That would be a death of dispar filled distopia. Do we not have enough virgins jacking to internet porn all day with crippling depression.
People need relationships not better internet porn
Oh ok, let me just put this genie back in the bottle then…/s
Would men or the 70s traded in their lives for sexbots I wonder
You would have been into eugenics in the 1930s