No, it’s because their manager who manages the business(hypothetically) isn’t paying them.
Just like groceries don’t include tax in the advertised price. the system is designed to screw us over.
Just like groceries don’t include tax in the advertised price.
Nah, that’s just in America, because Americans are dumb. Tipping doesn’t exist here BTW, because it’s idiotic and why would we do that.
(if Americans aren’t dumb, why did they vote for Trump twice?)
(I finally found an upside to the Trump presidency!)
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Australians don’t tip, and Canadians are just Americans with a French accent.
Almost 70 million people voted against him, myself included. We’re not a monolith. Also, only 11 states tax groceries.
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Americans are dumb af. Source: am American
Tipping doesn’t exist here BTW, because it’s idiotic
Idk where “here” is, but I’ve seen plenty of foreign countries’s restaurants adopting tipping, particularly at higher end establishments, as business owners realize they can just ask for extra and get it.
American culture is still seen as something to emulate in many parts of the world. Hopefully less so after the next four years. We’ve had the same stupid tipping culture emerge here as well - seems like a sign that taxes aren’t high enough at the top end.
American culture is still seen as something to emulate in many parts of the world. Hopefully less so after the next four years.
We used to export our culture to our satraps in Mexico and Germany and Japan and Korea. But now we tend to import more than we export.
I don’t see this as cultural though. It’s just a money thing. People ask because they know their customers will say yes. That’s all there is to if
To be fair, no products sold (that I’m aware of) include tax on the sticker price, and here in TX groceries (unprepared food) are not subject to state sales tax.
Exactly.
The reason, from my understanding, is that taxes on products can vary from region to region, so it’s impractical to expect the store to have the price listed with the sales tax included, especially on advertisements. The sales tax in my state can vary by 1% or so between cities/counties, and advertisements are frequently at the state level, if not national level. My next door city has a 0.10% lower sales tax rate vs my city, and the resort area in the county has 1.5% higher sales tax than the rest of the county.
Food is taxed at a different rate, and the tax is split about 50/50 between state and local. Our state has been discussing ending the tax on food, but that would only end the state portion (1.75%), so the local tax (1.25% pretty much everywhere) would remain.
AFAIK, Europe includes it because it’s imposed at the government level (I think EU?), not the local level.
I still think it’s dumb, and it should at least be on the price stickers in the store so I can have a chance at estimating the final bill before I get to the register.
It pits the well being of the customer against the well being of the server. It’s a pretty evil system. Pay everyone a living wage. Everybody deserves to live.
Here in Europe, waiters actually get a living wage, and still we’re expected to tip??? Like yo fuck that! I never go to regular restaurants unless it’s with a work colleague that refuses to go to the canteen. Oh my sweet canteen, so cheap yet plentiful, satisfying my stomach, mind and wallet, a true blessing.
As a European. What are you talking about? That’s certainly not the case in my part of Europe. And we don’t even have a minimum wage. (Officially)
Really? Holy shit… I’m in Czechia. And we have both living wages for waiters (it’s been driving our restaurant prices unusually high lately) and a minimum wage. Altho the minimum wage is quite low. Roughly 650€ of full-time when converted. Thankfully I haven’t seen jobs listed that low, I only know it because I managed to negotiate a payed internship and that’s what they gave me before my raise.
Oh don’t get me wrong. We got living wages for all full time jobs. Including waiters. We just don’t have a minimum wage (officially). It’s sorted out by the unions.
No one should really defend tipping. It literally has classist history that was updated from that to a racist history and criminal history.
I don’t think you can’t pay extra to someone because you liked them or what they did for you. We have whole holidays for gifts but man if people knew the history of tipping and why Europe picked up Americans anti tipping policy once upon a time I think we could move past it.
I only tip when I think they deserve a tip. I tipped the last meal I ate out. Nice person who checked every few minutes if we needed anything else. They kept our drinks from getting empty. The service was worth the tip so they got it. That is what the tip is for. Good service, not any service.
checked every few minutes
god damn, i would get annoyed from that much service.
She just walked by and checked. We were not the only table getting that kind of service. She only stopped when she saw a glass getting empty or when she saw we had finished the meal.
Yep, gimme the food and a kind word, then leave me alone and let me read.
tariffs
If you live in a place where food service workers are underpaid and you don’t tip, you’re an asshole. This is not a morally defensible stance unless there is a system to protect those workers already in place.
While I’m totally for the workers being paid great, it’s not really MY job to do so (unless i own the restaurant I’m eating at. And at those the waiters are paid way above average and don’t need tips). Here we tip for excellent service, not the bare minimum to get my food on the table.
If you tip to pay salaries, YOU are the actual asshole that keeps a system alive that is the absolute dogshit in dystopian shitholes with no worker-rights like the US.
If you’re patronizing a restaurant that underpays wait staff and refuse to tip the server, you’re not only fucking them but you’re supporting the system by going to the restaurant in the first place.
If you would’ve actually read the comment, you would’ve been in a clear advantage.
Where i live and eat, staff is paid fair and tips are given. But, as everywhere in this country, for especially good service and not because the customer is forced to because the employer doesn’t pay wages because the system is broken.
I also said that at my restaurants, waiting staff is paid way above average, which is probably multiple times of your weird country’s mininum. Do you even have a point?
Sure, let me help you! My point is that if you’re patronizing a restaurant that underpays wait staff and refuse to tip the server, you’re not only fucking them but you’re supporting the system by going to the restaurant in the first place.
You don’t even… Wow. Ok whatever. Suit yourself.
How does withholding a tip end the current system?
Stop going to such places. I don’t go there (because we don’t have that silly system). Why tip at all? Do u tip the cashier at the supermarket? Your IT-guy? Your mechanic? Your docs? The cops?
But for the sake of the argument: if noone would tip, noone would work as a waiter anymore and employers would have to pay decent salaries. You know, like everyone civilized would do. Instead you support a disgusting asshole employee by paying the staffs salary AND food. What’s next? No salary at all and you should double-tip for rent too? It seems to work. Why not.
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We don’t tip workers in those other fields you mentioned because they make a livable wage. Food service workers, particularly servers, often make less than minimum wage.
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I’m glad wherever you live pays their wait staff a livable wage. If that happened in the US, tipping wouldn’t be the way it is now. Unfortunately the system has to change first. Until it does, if a customer patronizes a restaurant, they should tip. If someone can’t afford to tip, they should stay home.
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The “invisible hand of the market” isn’t going to solve this issue. A change in labor law will. We either need state or federal laws to protect food service workers. Then employers will be forced to pay their staff better and tipping won’t be so compulsory.
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We could probably argue about “living wage” of a supermarket cashier. Here they all, at least, make minimum wage. So tipping cashiers should be equally fine as tipping waiters.
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Yes, the system is bad. Not the customer that don’t wanna tip. If 100% would not tip, the system HAS to change as noone would work as a waiter anymore. Doesn’t happen, so no change will ever happen. Except maybe paying them even less coz the customers compensate it willingly. Not ideal too, yes. Hence i would stop eating outside if i would live in such a system.
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Yes. Sure. But obviously it works great, so where’s the need for change? People still wanna work waiting and people still tip. And considering you guys vote billionaires for your representative, it’s all working as intended. There’s even wiggle-room to milk you for even more… But i would hope for u guys that there ever will be some good change.
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You’re correct. Their wage is often ~$3/hr. It’s nearly slave labor.
You’re right. I should just not go there at all, watch the business collapse, and see them beg for jobs at the next shitty restaurant. That’s the better option apparently?
That is the high road tbh… plus you can just go to joints that not require tipping. They are on the rise.
Also, many places just slap 20% now anyway… so we are in some clown reality where it is now a service fee and owner can just take it because they pay minwage lol
Peasants can never win here.
Yes
yes. you accidentally hit on the decent thing to do. if you can’t afford tipping in the context of a system that forces individuals to rely on it, go buy groceries.
And you think the customer is the asshole because the system works.
Customers who don’t tip are. They are punishing a worker for the crimes of a system. The restaurant owner/manager doesn’t suffer if you don’t tip. Only the workers do. So until a change comes to the system where workers get paid minimum wage, not tipping isn’t morally defensible.
You said it yourself, it’s the system that needs to change. As long as we keep chasing our tails trying to blame the customer base instead of the real problem, the ones profiting keep laughing.
*edited 1st sentence for better phrasing
Okay? So push for better laws and higher minimum wage on one hand and until those changes are made, then tip with the other. We can do both at the same time. Right?
I would love to agree. Unfortunately this just circles us back to what ObjectivelyIncarnate said above me
They’re not employed by me. Wages are between them and their boss. Any more from anywhere else should not be treated as anything other than the optionally-given gift it is.
Tipping culture essentially amounts to legalized wage discrimination.
walk it yourself then
Literally happens every time you get food from a place that serves you from a bar and STILL expects a tip.
gladly would if they’d let me
Except the food cost is only a small part of what we are paying for at a restaurant. What we are paying for is the worker’s time and skills. We could, mostly, eat the same ingredients at home for much cheaper.
A lot of the other costs are small and make profit in scale.
In this case wouldn’t the cooks time and skills be more important? Almost anyone can carry a plate but it takes a more diverse set of skills to cook various meals in timely manner while trying to prepare another 10 orders as well.
Not to say the server isn’t important as well but tbh, I’d rather have shitty service and great tasting food than have amazing service and terrible food. Ideally great food and great service, that will defintely get me back.
Cooks wages are integrated into the price of the food, and the waiter’s are not. But some times cooks are tipped out too.
Sounds like a broken system where workers are being exploited. The operating costs of everything should be pirced into the food. Customer’s shouldn’t be expected to subsidize wages.
And you don’t have to subsidize them. Just don’t give those restaurants your patronage. The owners are the problem, right? Don’t support them!
You undervalue good service. Good service, like good cooks, keep people with allergies from dying. Who exactly do you think passes on the allergy information? In a more general manner, good service makes sure that your order is presented the the kitchen staff correctly and matches expectations when they say it’s ready. It’s not just about whether or not they have a pleasant demeanor.
I could get the best service I’ve ever had, if the food tastes bad, makes me sick, or is undercooked I won’t be returning.
I could have rude service, have to send my order back for being wrong, and maybe even wait a while, if that food is delicious I’ll be coming back.
It takes a whole team to run a restaurant but if the food sucks or is unsafe no amount of good service will make up for that.
hey the waiter doesnt carry the food, the runner does that
the waiter asks me how im doing every 5 minutes and upsells me drinks and excess food. now that is special
Is that really what you think is all they do? I’ve run restaurants and they’re like what nurses are to hospitals, the ones doing most of the work. Everything from cleaning the restaurant to stocking everything, keeping the cooks happy and helping in any way they can
YT things
never mess with the people who handle your food.
Reminds me of that episode of Scrubs, where Dr Cox was going around with a tip jar, because if a guy pouring coffee gets a tip, he should get one from the people whose lives he saved.
“Why tip someone for a job I’m capable of doing myself? I can deliver food, I can drive a taxi, I can and do cut my own hair. I did, however, tip my urologist. Because I am unable to pulverize my own kidney stones.” -Dwight Schrute, “The Office”
Makes me glad I live in a state that got rid of the tipped minimun and just has one across the board minimum wage.
I’m so sad we voted against it. Legalizing magic mushrooms had more support than making tipped minimum wage the same as normal minimum wage.
Fellow mass-hole! Felt the same way, even our allegedly liberal Governor came out against both. I talked to servers and bartenders who thought they’d make a lot less money, or their restaurant would go out of business if it passed. Presumably because the owners told them so.
To insure proper service. Congratulations, everyone at the joint now knows your face and that you’re cheap.
You’ll get the worst service imaginable at your once favorite place. You’ve ruined it for yourself.
So waiters spit in my food because I pay the amount that’s in the menu, and I’m the problem here?
Jokes on you, we don’ 'Merica
That isn’t where “tip” comes from.
Sounds a lot like the maffia. “Pay protection money or else we’ll tear your shop down”
So what you’re saying is, tips are bullshit, and it’s really just a shakedown? Got it.
