• HStone32@lemmy.world
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    18 days ago

    The amount of time my classmates have spent dealing with vscode crashing, freezing, breaking, etc is way beyond negligible. And yet, I’m the weird guy apparently for preferring vim and GCC.

  • ZILtoid1991@lemmy.world
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    22 days ago

    The comparison is bad. It’s more like comparing a kind of crappy car to a nice unicycle once you factor in UX. Not everyone likes to punch in key combinations so complicated it’s making game cheats look simple in comparison.

  • TrickDacy@lemmy.world
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    22 days ago

    It always surprises me how complicated some of the editor tooling sounds in threads like this. Obviously once you learn how to use these things they are powerful, but how do people have the patience to deal with all of that in the beginning? This is coming from a guy who writes scripts constantly to avoid doing tedious, error-prone things.

    Also I keep seeing people say vscode is slow. One of the reasons I switched to it is that it’s insanely fast compared to other editors I used (even those with far-inferior featuresets) 🤷‍♂️

    • MajorHavoc@programming.dev
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      15 days ago

      but how do people have the patience to deal with all of that in the beginning?

      Whenever I was frustrated with a stupid undecipherable error message, I would just tweak my vim config a bit.

      Within a few minutes, my rage at the error would be completely replaced with rage toward vimscript.

      Then I would revert my vim config change, and return to the undecipherable error message with a fresh perspective. mainly relief that at least it’s not vimscript.

      Joking aside, I really did learn vim mostly during coffee breaks or while waiting on some long running build process.

  • dejected_warp_core@lemmy.world
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    22 days ago

    I would argue that vim is fantastic for a lot of editing and coding tasks, just not all of them.

    Where it utterly fails is with deep trees of files in codebases, like you see in Java or some Javascript/Typescript apps. Even with a robust suite of add-ons, you wind up backing into full-bore IDE territory to manage that much filesystem complexity. Only difference is that navigating and managing a large file tree w/o a mouse is kind of torture.

    • murtaza64@programming.dev
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      22 days ago

      Once I got used to single-directory filetree browsing plus fuzzy finding, I have never been able to comfortably use a traditional filetree anymore. most of them are not designed for efficient keyboard use (vscode and intellij at least) and don’t really help understanding the structure of the project imo (unless there arent that many files). For massive projects I find it easier to spend the initial effort of learning a few directory names and the vague structure using oil.nvim, and then eventually I can just find what I need almost instantly by fuzzy finding.

    • expr@programming.dev
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      22 days ago

      File-based navigation is often inefficient anyway (symbolic navigation is much better when you can), but if you do need it, that’s what fuzzy finders are for. Blows any mouse-based navigation out of the water.

      The only time a visual structure is useful is when you are actually just interested in learning how things are structured for whatever reason, but for that task, tree works just fine anyway.

    • ivn@jlai.lu
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      22 days ago

      Fuzzy finding really shine for this use case, no need for a mouse.

      • stetech@lemmy.world
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        10 days ago

        To you, @[email protected], and anyone else planning to do the switch:

        Back when I was still a VSC(odium) user, you needed to perform a small tweak to regain access to the quite useful extensions marketplace (in the sense of, paste the extension ID, see the same results as a M$ VSCode user*): There is a file named product.json which allows you to “regain” access if you populate it with the following values:

        {
          "extensionsGallery": {
            "serviceUrl": "https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/_apis/public/gallery",
            "itemUrl": "https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items",
            "cacheUrl": "https://vscode.blob.core.windows.net/gallery/index",
            "controlUrl": ""
          }
        }
        

        (Taken from my old dotfiles, so this may be outdated, not sure. Also, you’ll have to look up the location of this file, it will differ depending on OS. On macOS it goes in ~/Library/Application Support/VSCodium.)

        *If you do not need this 1:1 identical functionality, you may try the Open VSX marketplace. But especially in a class setting, I found this very useful, since all the tutorials/instructions will work without needing adaptation.

  • Lettuce eat lettuce@lemmy.ml
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    22 days ago

    I plan on moving to a nice Neovim setup eventually, but VSCodium is so convenient out of the box for a baby developer like me.

    • Integrate777@discuss.online
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      22 days ago

      You’ll be glad to know that the difficulty comes from the syntax and very little from any programming skill level. You learn new ways of writing certain code structures like indented curly braces for example. Programming python might be easier than cpp in vim, not due to the language, but just cpp having more complex syntax to type.

      Tldr, almost exactly the same amount of effort whether you’ve been coding for two weeks or two years.

    • 1984@lemmy.today
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      22 days ago

      I switched to zed too. It’s not perfect but it’s just nice to use a different editor that is not sluggish.

    • Nester@feddit.uk
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      22 days ago

      Just out of interest, what are the reasons someone would move from neovim to helix?

      • fxomt@lemm.ee
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        22 days ago

        Immediately after you install helix, you can start working, no config required. It’s really nice.

        It also has OOTB LSP, unlike in neovim where you have to setup manually for each installed LSP, helix just detects it. I also personally think it has better keybinds than neovim.

        But it still doesn’t have a plugin system, and it’s quite opinionated. They’re both amazing, and great options. Just depends on what you want in an editor; customizability, or do you want it to just work.

        • Nester@feddit.uk
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          22 days ago

          Personally, I love to tinker (especially on my main machine) so I don’t mind the complexities of setting up neovim. However, I do mess around with a bunch of servers, and I like to edit code on those servers, meaning I am often installing/compiling neovim and copying over my config before I can get to work.

          What I am liking about helix is the idea that its default setup has what I need to get started straight away.

          I am looking forward to giving helix a go.

          • fxomt@lemm.ee
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            22 days ago

            So do i :) but i think helix is especially powerful with nix, for example. instead of having 5 compilers, lsps and such installed, you can create a nix flake for your project and it’ll install all that stuff for you. But for neovim you’d have to manually configure those LSPs in your config, so it is kind of just pointless anyway. But helix automatically loads all your installed LSPs, no config required. I love that about it, but neovim has grown on me.

            Plus, helix’s keybinds are amazing, even better than neovims. God i miss it.

      • count_duckula@discuss.tchncs.de
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        22 days ago

        I switched after development ended on the package manager I was using on neovim. I didn’t at that moment want to simplify my vimconfig, so I looked into helix.

        Helix highlights the action you take, so if for example, you are deleting 5 lines, you select the lines first then hit delete. Sometimes the vim actions end up taking fewer keystrokes though. And I still prefer some ways vim does things. And I don’t always agree with the kakoune inspiration of helix (I haven’t used kakoune, just going by what the docs say) - for example, movement always selects text which I then have to unhighlight.

        But the biggest reason I stuck to helix was sane LSP defaults out of the box with minimal config. I was tired of having to fix LSP related bugs in my vim config after package updates.

        TLDR: saner defaults for helix + lazy to fix my bloated vimconfig.

      • lime!@feddit.nu
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        22 days ago

        i have sort of done this. the main thing is that the reversed object-verb command model just… latches onto your brain. this is from kakoune of course, but it just makes a lot of sense coming from vimland. multicursor is also nice because it removes some modes, meaning there is less state to keep in your head. finally, the plug-and-play nature of helix means you can have an lsp-enabled environment from the word go, with no configuration.

    • MajorHavoc@programming.dev
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      21 days ago

      Nah. As a die hard Vim user, I can explain all day long why a flexible shared common editing experience across a team is a great idea, and why VSCodium is the obvious choice.

      And I’ll explain and agree in principle all day long from the familiar beloved comfort of my Vim editor.

    • lime!@feddit.nu
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      22 days ago

      vis is such a neat idea, i followed it years ago. any good plugins yet? i really love the structural regex workflow but since kakoune/helix hijacked my muscle memory i would need more support for external tools to go full vis…

      • m4m4m4m4@lemmy.world
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        22 days ago

        The thing about good plugins is relative - I just have vis-pairs, but I am not a seasoned developer (I’m not even a formal developer/CS person, just a graphic designer doing frontend and a tiny bit of backend!) so I don’t really miss anything else. vis’ phylosophy relies on the unix-as-ide concept, though. Still I do know that there is stuff like a LSP plugin.

        What I really miss from vim is buffers. vis still does not have a client/server feature so you still have to rely in its allegedly temporary split panes kinda solution. It seems vis’ main developer got some personal issues going on so volunteers are doing some little changes here and there but with so few manpower it doesn’t seem like those needed big changes are happening anytime soon. Hence why I’m trying to spread its gospel in hopes to get people interested in contributing to it.

          • m4m4m4m4@lemmy.world
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            22 days ago

            No, for example I can open two or more splits (horizontal or vertical) - the catch there is that I can’t open an horizontal split AND a vertical split. If I have two horizontal splits and want a vertical one, the previous two would go vertical (?). I read somewhere on the issues list that this was rather a temporary solution to be able to “see”/“edit” more than one file at the same time.

            Not to mention there aren’t things like tabs or windows. They want to let that be managed by a window manager, which sounds like the sane thing to do, but as I was telling before - not enough people with enough time to pull that off. The discussion about the RPC interface goes from a while back: https://github.com/martanne/vis/issues/59