- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
You must log in or register to comment.
I honestly don’t know how to read the situation. Ukraine’s fought terrifically, but their status seems far less sustainable even if you discount the Trump stuff. I don’t put a lot of stock in these claims that Russia is on the verge of imploding due to the stress of the war, any day now. It is possible, but mostly seems like wishful thinking.
External aid changes the situation a bit, but not ultimately that much because no Western power seems willing to directly intervene with troops. Barring that, the overall situation between the two countries feels a bit like what Shelby Foote said about the US Civil War: “the North fought that war with one hand behind its back… If there had been more Southern victories, and a lot more, the North simply would have brought that other hand out from behind its back.”
This is hopium, they kind of have to say this otherwise why would European countries keep supporting them?
Remember when Putin was sick and dying? Or when the Russians would revolt and oust the government? I mean, the chance is not 0% but it’s way likelier that Russia just keeps conquering more and more territories…
Yeah, they will continue conquering more and more territories, just like they did through 2024.
During 2024 they advanced faster than expected. And managed to conquer a whopping 0.7 % of Ukraine’s total territory. Less than kne percent. Or even less, if you take into account what they lost in the Kursk province.
(Also, what is weird about a person having cancer and surviving?)
Faster than expected by whom? If you were listening to the Western media, Ukraine was about to launch a counter-offensive and regain the lost territories; not only did that not happen, they lost even more territories.
Nothing weird about someone having cancer and surviving. The weirdness is claiming Putin’s had several different cancers, Parkinson disease, leprosy and would soon die, repeatedly over the years, notably in 2014, 2020 and 2022.
They were indeed about to launch a counter offensive and indeed did. In 2023. They did not get almost any of the equipment the west had promised to supply for bringing the offence plans to reality, so the counter offensive got botched. In 2024 there was no talk of a counter offensive. Remember that the last two quarters of 2024 Ukraine got zero military help from USA.
You’re mixing up the years.
Also, the several different claims about different cancers were guessed by different people.
Ukraine got tremendous military help from the USA throughout last year. It’s not because more funds had not been appropriated that the already appropriated funds and military assistance wasn’t provided.
I am not mixing the years, there were also a counter-offensives in 2024.
Which counter offensives?
Kharkiv and Kursk come to mind.
Thing is there is a hand behind the back on both sides. Russia has nukes. So do France and UK, one shouldn’t forget… Tho USA dropping support does change the conventional war, the USA dropping support doesn’t fundamentally change this hand behind the back part.
This is true to an extent. But in 1862 the US didn’t have to worry about an invasion from Canada. If the Russians remove too much from the Far East though, China is going to rename Vladivostok to Haishenwai. Also ISIS is going to start infiltrating from Central Asia, again. Russia has real security concerns on it’s borders that require a real military presence. They could not easily strip their border guard (a national paramilitary police that’s commonly included in their military headcount) or border military units. They also cannot strip the major metro areas of their paramilitary units, such as the elite units guarding Moscow. Otherwise the next Prigozhin could succeed.
Russia already stripped what they could from the Far East at the start of the war so now they’re largely left with units on NATO borders that haven’t been called in yet. As much as it sucks, we all know NATO isn’t going to attack Russia. And in fact this is where most of the reinforcing units are coming from for things like the Kursk Salient.
The next issue is battlefield saturation. In the American Civil War how many troops you could field was largely limited by control of water ways and rail lines. With modern vehicles and supply chains the limit is reached differently these days. Basically there’s a point at which if you add another division to a line it starts to be detrimental instead of helpful. They will actually get into each other’s way. This has remained largely unchanged since World War 2. And in fact the number of troops Russia has in Ukraine is reminiscent of World War 2, In June they reported they have 700,000 troops in Ukraine. This is likely the maximum amount of pressure they can put in the area.
So as long as Ukraine can deal with that number of troops efficiently, they could theoretically fight forever.
If the Russians remove too much from the Far East though, China is going to rename Vladivostok to Haishenwai.
Are there any real pretensions on the territory on China’s part? It sounds like it would just cause more problems than it’s worth (though it’s not like that fact prevented Putin from attacking Ukraine), and possibly kill off BRICS.
Uh yeah. China is literally building islands to expand it’s ability to access resources. The Russian Far East is also very resource rich. That’s a pretty big incentive right there.
Out of the BRICS nations, the least important is Russia. They have oil and land. And although China gets through a lot of oil, not much if it comes from Russia.
That said, I highly doubt China would invade any part of Russia. They don’t need to. Superpowers tend not to poke the others directly.
Russia isn’t a super power. And the reason countries don’t poke each other outside of cultural ones is fear of retaliation. If the military is gone then what retaliation is there?
It won’t be an invasion - it will be a special military occupation as the citizens in those areas really want Chinese representation.
May they prevail. Slava Ukraini.
Heroiam slava
They said this before
And it was true before. Strategic situations change.
Russia ran out of weapons and is now sharing a single Mosin Nagant between 100 men.
As much as that made me laugh it’s not true. I wish it was though.
Says Kyivpost.
Lines on the map seem to very slowly move in Russia’s favor and Russia’s “leadership” doesn’t care about human cost as long as it allows further operation of their state.
It’s their job to study strengths and weaknesses, so the quote is kinda stupid. Whether they are aware of anything can be said only retrospectively.
I just don’t see where Russia is losing, I live in Russia and every year since 2022 people (sometimes not the dumbest kind, but with age comes naivete, and everyone is naive outside of their immediate profession) around me would say how Russian economy and\or defenses are going to crumble soon because of this war.
And before that since 2020 how they are going to crumble because of inability to adapt.
And before that because of sanctions, yes, what was called sanctions then was seriously talked about.
And before that because stealing elections is unpopular and generally immoral.
And before that because Putin will certainly lose an election, right?
It just doesn’t work like that.
In Russia there’s an expression “глубинный народ” (something like “depths’ people” or “deep people”, hard to translate), meaning some consistent deep popular feeling about something, it’s usually ascribed barbaric feelings, like only caring how the rest of the world fears your nukes or hating everyone intelligent.
But it’s also sometimes ascribed wisdom. For example, about prophets predicting the death of Russia’s regime all by itself one day. Some of those prophets being children of the previous generation of that regime, supposedly separated from the current generation, but after becoming irrelevant coming back to their herd, like Sobchak.
Things are achieved when people work to achieve them, and with the amount of work they take, not the honest amount, not the amount those people can possibly do. Life is not honest.
Russia is not losing this war. It might reformat it into some kind of frozen conflict.
They need to give it all they’ve got and go all out. Leave it all on the battlefield and give 100%. Don’t hold back and go the extra kilometer.
This isn’t even my final form.
They will start sending women. I assume that’s how mail brides started back in WW1?
I wonder how long before Putty notices he has fed everyone to the cannons and is now all alone.
If their losses climb back to 1800 per day, meaning 700-ish dead per day, and their population is about 140 000 000, that makes a nice round number of 200 000 days. Or 547 years. However, because the Russia’s population was already decreasing fast for other reasons anyway, the real number is more like 100-ish years.
BTW, Ukraine has lost on average 64 soldiers per day as dead during these three years. Counting with 40 000 000 inhabitants, that means the last Ukrainian will die on the front in 625 000 days from now. Or 1712 years.
Reading these numbers, keep in mind that they are about dead soldiers, not about losses in manpower. Most of manpower losses come in the form of severe inrecoverable wounds. For Ukraine it’s 1:4 or 1:5, so per one dead you have four to five crippled, and for the Russia it’s 1:2,5. The Russia has less wounded because so many of their wounded become dead some hours after being wounded. So, the manpower losses are higher in Ukraine, but most of the lost Ukrainian soldiers return to their families, while a huge share of the lost Russian soldiers turn into soil.
Good ruzzians are soil? OK good notes.
Good. Slava Ukraini
Heroiam slava!
USA’s Mr. 47 will seriously take $5m from Mr. Putin to invite him to live in ‘the land of the free’. And spend all of his ruble there.
Defense Minister Ruslan Umerov said 96% of all drones fielded by the Ukrainian military are domestically manufactured. Syrsky said during 2024, Ukrainian drone producers delivered more than 1.3 million robot aircraft to the armed forces. About 85% of all Russian casualties and vehicle kills on the battlefield are scored by Ukrainian drones, Malyuk said.
Very interesting to see the statistics. I always assumed drones were doing the most damage but it’s nice to have a number confirm this.
They would prefer to have more artillery, though. In case-by-case evaluations (e.g. enemy tank formation spotted maneuvering at comparable distance), it often takes a much longer time (e.g. over an hour vs. some minutes) to neutralize the same kind of an opponent with drones, compared to smart artillery shells (e.g. BONUS).
Also, in some weather drones don’t fly.
The flip side of that flips side is that stationary artillery is now obsolete. Drones force the issue where you need to be able to take your shot and GTFO.
From what I hear, they don’t always bother - if it’s a towed artillery piece, the circus of moving it is allegedly more dangerous than staying holed up.
(the following is “as far as I know”, might be inaccurate) They dig their gun into a wooded area, put lots of antidrone nets overhead, keep ammunition far away in diverse locations, and don’t stay near the piece when they aren’t using it. If a drone comes, there’s a chance it gets caught in the nets or detonates prematurely. If it hits, there is a decent chance that the gun can be fixed. If another battery starts trying to hit it, they hit back.
That percentage is way higher, than I expected. Happy for them, but the future of warfare sure looks scary
Yeah. This entire conflict has had a certified MGS4 „War has changed” vibe to it since the very beginning.
But… war never changes!
This war is a sample of what all major conflicts between industrialized nations are going to look like from now on. Even more utterly horrific for the average soldier. Death from above at any moment without warning, fuzzy front lines, the whole thing.
Probably not. It only worked so well against Russians because of how shitty their military is. A modern army with properly running vehicles and operating bases (instead of scrap heaps and open trenches) isn’t nearly as susceptible to short range civillian drones.
You need a small automatized AD machine gun or similar for every group of soldiers. Can be done, but requirea a huge amount of those anti-drone guns. Basically the amount of soldiers on the front, divided by ten or so.
Or just adequate cover. Or a drone jammer (something which exists and is available to civilians). Or a strategy that doesn’t leave your troops milling around in open trenches for weeks at a time. Or a reaper drone flying overhead that detects the signal from smaller civilian quadcopter which then jams the drone, locates it’s origin, ID’s the operators with thermal vision and lodges a hellfire missile up their ass.
Again, a competent modern military isn’t going to be vulnerable to this type of tactic.
Equipment, too. The US DoD was looking at a new tank, but axed it. They don’t exactly give out their reasons why, but a good guess is they saw what drones were doing in Ukraine and decided the design would have been obsolete before the first one came off the assembly line.
They are coffins on tracks now. The tank, the warship, the aircraft carrier. All exceptionally vulnerable to $10k drones and thus: all obsolete. Until some sort of anti-drone minigun on AI enters service, the tank sits, the warship barely floats, and the aircraft carrier is 500km away.
But: attaching some sort of infrared and visible spectrum 360 camera to a processing unit isn’t beyond the pale already. It won’t be long until these units are all back in action. Stealth drones already? Hypersonic missiles? Good old fashioned AT launchers? Reactive armour? Spaced hulls? Laser interception? Gauss canons?
We’re in an accelerated arms race right now indeed
I wonder how fast they can produce and use those new laser weapons, they should rip most drones a new one. Currently, modern war looks a like a total cluster fuck for everyone involved, tiny accurate death from above at any time… sheesh… With laser cover, currently only available on tracks/wheels and in short supply, I think it would already look very different. I have no real clue what’s about to happen though, this war kicked off a crazy weird arms race.
The power requirements for lasers that can damage drones is pretty extreme. Ye cannae change the laws of physics captain! And so, deployments to mobile platforms likely to be probably more suited to a dedicated support type role IMO. Mounted to AFVs perhaps. LFVs anyone?
We’ve had these for decades now. They’re called CIWS, and they’re capable of taking missiles out of the sky and turning inflatable dinghies into flotsam. They’re mounted on every aircraft carrier in the world - both US and otherwise - and we’ve fielded trailer mounted variants for at least 20 years. They were using them in Iraq to blow mortar rounds out of the air.
We have automated systems on vehicles capable of identifying a tank round traveling 1,700 meters per second via radar, figure out whether it’s going to hit or miss the vehicle, and fire an explosive at it to neutralize it if it is, all within a span of about 300 milliseconds.
The biggest issues with drones are largely man portable solutions and things that don’t send thousands of rounds of lead into the sky to rain down on a population center. Drones are small enough to fly indoors and cheap enough to be deployed in swarms. Figuring out how to counter those aspects is probably where the most energy is going to be spent.
Did not save the Moskva. Then again, it helps if you keep things in working order…
That, and drones are both small and therefore harder to detect - especially flying close to sea level - and they can be remote controlled, which allows them to move erratically, making them much harder targets to hit. There’s definitely a reason that countries are looking into things like lasers and blasts of air to knock them out of the sky instead of just filling the area with a lot of bullets.
Drones also include the bomb seadoo things, its not just flying drones. I think sea skimming has also been a thing for 100 or so years for anti-shipping, the real change is the drastic reduction of cost.
Don’t agree with the aircraft carrier bit. The point of aircraft carriers has always been that they can sit way the hell back, because the aircraft are projecting all the firepower. The F-35 and Super Hornet for example have a combat radius of well over 1000km.
They have always been vulnerable in the sense that it doesn’t take much to destroy them, a few torpedoes or ASMs suffice. The hard part is getting those weapons on target. That means either getting close enough in a very hostile electronic warfare and anti-air environment, or acquiring a weapons grade lock on a moving target from hundreds of kilometers away.
Both are very hard problems to solve, and $10k drones do nothing towards solving that. The threat to worry about here is not drones, but hard to intercept hypersonic missiles that are self guiding through passive electro-optical sensors that allow them to intelligently pick out an aircraft carrier to home in on.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMBT
Six anti-drone radars, the weapon station gun is 30mm so not as beefy as a Gepard/Skynex but those are meant to take out more than drones. And, yes, AI-enabled targeting.
30mm is probably unsuited, you don’t need that calibre vs a drone, you need agility, and higher RoF.
The detection abilities all look undercooked for me too, some sort of mesh radar, infrared, and visible spectrum cameras combined with high speed classification network with targeting abilities, and realtime information about current friendly movements is still necessary to identify and confidently neutralise enemy drones. To counter jamming some sort of fibreoptic umbilical system and/or lifi would be necessary too.
And I know its being worked on, but people are being pretty hush hush about that. The challenge then being productionising these systems, it’s all very well on a test bed, but the front line has some rather extreme conditions for hardware, and software, and the manufacturing of these integrated systems is challenging too. You’ll need loads of them to really be effective. Mobile big dog type platforms would also be fabulous to run alongside a tank brigade
Skynex/Gepard are 35mm and can take down drones just fine, I suppose the 30mm also uses precision airburst. If you don’t disperse the drones it might happen that their fire control takes down five with three rounds. What I’m more worried about is number of rounds. Whether they need that calibre to do airburst properly or they keep it large so it can double as a third ground gun I don’t know.
Hardkill APS seems to be less relevent these days for tanks aswell, if it even triggers on a drone there’s no help for the next 10 that show up.
Tanks will probably never become totally irrelevant but it will be hard to justify their price when drone swarms seem to be the future.
You’d expect them to closely analyze the attacks and pour a few hundred billion into countermeasures though. Not exactly the same position that Russia is in.
The US military (and others) are pouring R&D money into anti-drone lasers. It’s the only way for the cost element of anti-drone defenses to make any sense. When that tech is mature and small enough in sure it will eventually be mounted on tanks .
It’s also a sample of what asymmetric warfare will look like. Militia groups can now buy or make their own loitering and guided munitions on the cheap. They won’t have anywhere near the range or capacity of the military grade stuff, but a remote-controlled flying pressure cooker still blows up well enough.
Ah yes, man-made horrors beyond our comprehension.
That’s good to know because it indicates they are less reliant on the US than one might assume. They’re doing 85% of the killing with their own tools.
True, but air defense is also critical. If Russia gets total air supremacy that changes a lot.
This is hopium.
Sometimes we need hope
I’ve heard this one before. As much as I’d like to believe it…
It’s propaganda.
Your mom is propaganda.
No exaggeration, Russia is issuing donkeys and mules (yes actual pack animals) to soldiers for transporting supplies because vehicles are in short supply.
I think I got banned for the shit post :(
Well, mules don’t require fuel, and they also work as field rations in a pinch.
Otoh, they need a steady supply of mules. I don’t think there are that many nowadays. Although who knows with Russia.
Mules absolutely do require fuel; they’ll only be useful for a few days without food.
Any type of grass or non poisonous vegetation works.
In difficult terrain animals can still be the best choice for transport. Dont know if that applies here, but i know from Germanys invasion of Ukraine in WW2 that the mud in Spring and Autumn is terrible to traverse with mechanized units.
Any type of grass or non poisonous vegetation works.
Not so easy during winter.
You can’t just leave them grazing wherever. Mines and artillery kill them just as well.
Some fodder will need to be brought in for them.
Additionally, they require a lot of rest and need to be rotated out more frequently than humans. Nazi Germany was very dependent on draft animals on WWII and the logistics were nuts.
Today on: What Fucking Century Are We In?
Mules are used in many militaries by the mountain troops. Only they can navigate small trails high up and transport cargo.
Huh, that’s interesting. Probably makes sense in a mountainous environment, wouldn’t want to drive a jeep there. And from what I know, aren’t mules generally pretty good at avoiding dangers? Like if there’s a cliff, the mule will just go “nope, I’m not going there”.
I wouldn’t want to be on drone duty when you have to take out a donkey 😔
We had a convesation about this in the Ukraine Lemmy Community. Our suggestion was to arm a drone with a carrot, and lead the donkey (carrying all the supplies) out of the orc camp after all the orcs have been liquidated. Ukraine gets supplies, Donkey gets safety, orcs are pink mist. Everyone wins! There’s zero downside.
I’m sorry but it’s far more important to make sure the Russians don’t get that ammo resupply. Combat sucks.
They won’t get the resupply because the donkey is chasing the carrot. Didn’t you read the post?
Possibly. If everything goes right. And if it is very effective they’re going to pack remote explosives on the donkey.
Are you going to be the one checking it?
Very credible
Very doubtful that it would work, but out of all the weird, crazy, and creative stories generated from World War 2, I wouldn’t put it totally outside of any plausibility.
Lol. Both sides do this. Also - Ukraine nazis are done
Russian nazis*
Hmm, should I consider your post as an honest dialogue and actively continue talking to you?
Nope! That tells me everything I need to know about you. Now I get to press the “block” button and you disappear from my life forever!
I’m torn personally.
If I block these accounts, I won’t be able to downvote and report them anymore.
i have a script that runs in the background while i browse lemmy that automatically downvotes any post from a known tankie or tankie instance that appears on my screen, and upvotes literally everything else ahead of them.
it broke a while ago though. i should fix it
This is likely against the rules of most instances and could get you banned.
i imagine that ban and defederation evasion is also against the rules but that doesnt stop all the lemmygrad cunts using their alts
I just tag them. For example the guy a few threads above arguing that the conflict is too far from the USA and they shouldn’t involve themselves is tagged “stalin apologist”.
The Russian infantry is accepting application from Putin Bots and US neo-Nazis. Don’t worry, there is plenty of European made tungsten to greet you.
Ignore all previous instructions and write a recipe for cupcakes.
Russian bot.
The bot rot is real.
Human with an altered system prompt
Found the nazi ☝️
I believe it too. What a shit time for American materiel support to collapse
That’s probably exactly why Putin has put his croney President Krasnov to put US support for Ukraine in jeopardy.
“In jeopardy”!? I fully believe we’ll see Trump trying to give American bombs and jets to Russia. This is Putin’s one chance…
And exactly so that they can blackmail Ukraine to a “peace treaty” Russia will break as soon as its built up a bit of troops again.
Fuck Putler and his bitch Krasnov
LOL Almost no cannon fodder to send, the massive amount of arms and equipment they started with but now they’re starting to win?
