For some context, we are first generation immigrants. My parents are Russian, my mother and her husband have been living here for 20 years (even got rid of Russian citizenship couple years ago), my biological father is still living in Russia.
It’s damn exhausting to discuss political topics with them, especially my father. He keeps telling me how great it is to live in Russia, how their economy is doing great and how he’s proud that they are defending their “brothers” in Donezk and Luhansk from the evil bandera regime in Ukraine.
My mom voted far right in the past election. She doesn’t believe she voted for nazis, but the party’s views on economics, climate policy and immigration seem to align with hers. She believes wind farms are harmful for the environment. What the actual fuck.
Whenever I try to argue with them, they tell me that I’ve been brainwashed by “Western propaganda”.
I’m at a loss. I love my parents and I know that nobody’s immune to propaganda, but it’s heartbreaking to see them holding these toxic beliefs. How would you deal with parents like these? Should I just declare to never talk about politics with them again since it’s pointless?
If you live with them it could be tricky but let them know you will not be talking politics or any kind of emotionally charged topic with them going forward. Lets keep it light and stick to the things we agree on and leave everything else at the door. Avoid talking about them or saying you or sounding accusatory to minimize defensiveness, just let them know these topics and conversations are not how you want to use your time and energy and thinking anymore.
If they start trying to drag you into a forbidden topic, simply let them know you are heading off to do something since you dont have anything to add or contribute to topics that you are uncomfortable with like you mentioned to them before.
Start with this and let us know if they bite. I’ve got some other ideas but start with this and see how it goes. At the end of the day, engaging in these kinds of discussions over and rehashed constantly is damaging and pointless so the key is transcending them by not participating in them or feeding the wrong wolf. Be polite and respectful but also assertive that you will not be dealing with these topics any longer
Although I don’t live with them, the topic comes up every time I am on the phone with my father. He keeps yapping and yapping about how great the motherland is, until I snap. It seems it’s all he ever wants to talk about - Putin this, Ukraine that.
Thank you for your advice, I’ll try setting up some boundaries next time he calls.
Ya just let him know you’re not spending your time and mental energy on that stuff. Stop talking to him on the phone or let him know that as soon as things are falling off course into that stuff, you gotta go and take a break from him for a few weeks.
Eventually he will get the message but if its still a problem after that, might need to go no contact to demonstrate you’re serious
I don’t talk politics. Not at work. Not to my parents. I just keep my opinions to myself to keep my sanity.
This is the way. Most loud people don’t talk politics, they just convey the latest talking points because they feel like being rewarded.
Just stay out of the stupid-shouting match.
I wouldn’t.
I’d approach it from a personal level, as in, “you’re disgusting for doing this, you’re disgusting for pretending any of this bullshit is defensible. This is beyond the pale. I’ll talk to you again if you stop it with the crap, not before. I’m ashamed to come from people who would do this.”
I don’t know if it’s a good idea to try and talk actual policy points with them. You think they reasoned their way there? This isn’t politics, it’s assholish indecency. Treat it like the thing it is.
Debating people who’s entire thing is “don’t be serious but make the others be” is dumb. Clown on em, tell them you can visit when they stop being transparently awful. Make it their job to patch things up, and don’t use kid gloves. Don’t allow the idea that they have a point into the conversation. That only applies to people who have points. Nazi shit gets you put in time out instead.
Don’t take up the mantle of always having to put out the fire they keep lighting in the bridge between you. They’ll burn it down and try to blame you for it, mark my words.
Oh hey we’re in the exact same boat! My parents are from Russia too and moved to Germany about 20 years ago. If the bureaucracy here wasn’t that slow, they would have had citizenship by now and 100% both voted AfD.
We never had a decent relationship and I’m not concerned about preserving anything, so the goal is to just fully cut all contact at some point 🤷
Until then, I just act ignorant whenever they bring up politics (like literally pretending to not know who Trump is, because “what, why would I pay attention to niche american politics, they’re literally an ocean away??”).
Works pretty well, sometimes it even does make them retrospect about why they would care so much about seemingly random topics (because Russian propaganda channels train them to react to specific buzzwords).
Ultimately, I don’t think they would ever change into better people and any energy put into changing their minds would be better used somewhere else.Tell them this, Can’t buy a house under Republicans,can’t buy a house under Democrats, while it’s great it worked out for them. You are not represented as a voter and they need to get their heads out of their ass. That is, if they try to push conservative ideas. Otherwise, let them be happy and stupid. The misery is coming for them eventually, so why rush them.
When I was younger, I would have argued till I was blue in the face. I’ve since learned to choose my battles and not waste my time and energy on battles I know I can’t win… so I’d leave it alone as much as they allowed it, and eventually refuse to discuss it at all if needed.
No contact
If you’re set on doing this you need to accept you may never be successful.
Also it has to be something gentle, not necessarily subtle, but compassionate. If you don’t accept that they believe in their views then they will only feel attacked and lash out for defense.
As for actually changing their views, choose one or two things that you can point to in examples they can observe. Propaganda has a very hard time defeating our own eyes and ears. I don’t even know which country you’re in so you’ll have to figure that out for yourself.
Another way to change their views is to get them to volunteer with organizations that help people down on their luck. A lot of times, just hearing the stories of how people ended up in need of help can change attitudes.
This is a positive recommendation :) know that you might succeed, but attempts coming from compassion instead of belittling or impatience. I tend to engage in asking certain questions until they reveal to themselves that they don’t support the things they’ve been tricked into believing
I work in Arizona with the homeless and downtrodden. The overwhelming majority of them are right wing and are homeless because they actively refuse help, among other severe mental health issues.
That sucks. I’ve had the opposite experience. Obviously the mental health issues are a thing but usually the people without those issues are keenly aware of why they slid into homelessness.
It’s damn exhausting to discuss political topics with them, […]
Then don’t, and if that’s the only thing they’re willing to talk about, make passive aggressive remarks about their lack of conversational creativity.
My therapist made a really great point when I brought up this exact issue with him. He asked if I value a relationship with my parents, and I said yes. Then he said that the price you have to pay for having a relationship with them, is never discussing politics.
It worked for a year or so, but then they voted for that rapist again, and I’ve since cut them out of my life. I’m not walking around on the eggshells of their bigotry and ignorance just so I can get some semblance of what some may describe as affection. You can only say/do so many shitty terrible things before I’m just done with you completely, and they hit their limit, so it was time to cash out.
Sorry, my advice of ignoring politics only works for a little while.
Rapist? You mean Bill Clinton? Or Biden, who showered with his 16 year old daughter?
Oh. Wow. Really stupid. I’m so sorry
Well, you do know Ol Bill was at Epstein Island sword fighting with Trump.
Good thing I didn’t vote for either of them or Biden in 2024.
I’m gonna need to see the receipts on this one. Sounds like some ‘pizza dungeon’ tripe.
Clinton was impeached for, at best, getting busy with a staff member. Maybe you have a different opinion, but I have a hard time believing things would have gotten as far as it did publicly if what truly happened was just some banal impropriety. Oh my, he got a blowjob from a college aged staffer? I doubt there are many presidents who haven’t. Why did this get far enough for immediate public knowledge?
Biden… before AI image generation took off, the magats made tons of compilations of pictures and videos of him making young girls obviously uncomfortable. Too much to just write off as coincidence or bad timing of photos. The bathing with his 16 year old daughter was from public statements made by the alleged victim, stating that it had happened.
Beyond all that, I have to get this off my chest: Y’all motherfuckers believe Epstein island is real (and it was), but you draw the line of believability at: “There’s no possible way the global elite could have sex trafficking infrastructure in the area surrounding a common meeting location. They would never use such obvious code language around pizza and pizza toppings. You know, the code language that can be verified to have been used by pedos on 4chan in the clearnet and that’s also been noted by darknet reseachers.”
I’m not saying the trumptards were 3000% correct to target a specific business owner, or it was in any way OK to condemn by public opinion without any true investigation.
But you are certifiably insane if you somehow don’t think that the elite have human trafficking services including heinously illegal and horrendous shit available at practically every port of call. That’s basic fucking kompromat generation tactics that most intel orgs the world over would be chomping at the bit to support. Fuckers.
I know I keep my tinfoil hat nice and shiny on this shit, but of all the things to push back against, you choose “The fellows at the top are likely rapists”?
If you don’t mind me asking, how often did politics come up with your parents?
Edit: just for my own perspective, they came up a little with my father while he was still alive and very, very rarely with my mother who I still see daily. I gently gauge the political position that my kids have but I’ve raised them all with empathy as a central tenet of their upbringing so that’s more or less where they tend to fall as best I can tell.
I am not interested in ending up where you did and I mean that with kindness.
My parents have conservative talk radio and/or fox news on basically 24/7 in their house and car, so there was really nowhere I could escape their politics. I figured out that all their talk was BS, but could never convince my parents of anything. I could take a quote from their favorite host, and pair it alongside facts stating the opposite was true from an organization that they, themselves, were members of, and they still would dismiss me.
In reality, it’s not the politics that got between us, it’s that they’re shitty people.
Have you seen the garbage dumps made up of the blades from wind farms that can’t be recycled? As for far right, Hitler was a fascist. Today the fascists are the far left, people like Antifa who believe violence is okay, in order to achieve their political beliefs. Imposing your beliefs on others using violence is fascism, and the left definitely engages in it. While I don’t think Putin is a good guy, it sounds like your Mom might be right about some things.
Political violence in the US is almost exclusively right wing these days. Fuck off with your lies and bullshit.
Have you send the ash lakes and ponds from industrial waste from coal power plants? Have breathed in the smoke as it fills the valleys of the mountains of your home state? Have you watched as rivers died from oxygen depletion? A couple tons of fiberglass is nothing compared to the shear desolation of carbon fuels. It’s easily contained.
There is a paradox known as the “tolerance paradox”. The basic premise is “should you tolerate the intolerant” while at first it may seem complex it’s really simple. No you should not. Those who call for violence on other deserve the boot. That is the difference between the left and the right. The right punishes those they deem ill fit to live in society. Forcefully. The left accepts, but are not push overs. Those who oppress deserve oppression.
What makes you think I want coal? Hydroelectric is the best way.
Hydroelectric is not the be all end all solution. It is highly local and has long term consequences to water ways, solar and wind are far superior in terms of environmental impact.
Wind and Solar are just as bad as coal. They require a lot of mining.
The mining isn’t entirely the bad part of coal. Mining can be contained it is a local pollutant. Burning it is the real issue. And fiberglass and solar panels are both made of silicon. One of the most abundant minerals on the planet it isn’t hard to get and mining it doesn’t create the same kind of drainage as coal mining.
But the diesel used to extract it, with the mining equipment, probably makes it a net loss over its lifetime. We’d have to see some studies on the power expended to create a solar panel, and how much it saves over it’s life, to see if solar is truly net savings over hydroelectric.
They have done the studies, it’s not. You can google to find them, I was going to pull them up for you but I’m out of my home country and I haven’t been able to access some sites for some reason.
Wind and especially solar produce a ton of energy. Some references I found stated a replacement rate of only a year for a wind turbine. Also you don’t need to use diesel to mine. Battery and electric operated heavy machinery are already in use.
There’s a whole lot of really wrong things there.
But show me those wind farm blade wastelands to start. Show me that - I’m gonna look by satellite because they’re huge - and we can talk later about those dangerous and violent anti-fascist types like demonstrators and veterans.
It would have taken less time to google yourself than type all those sentences. Go look.
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Books or audio books on the subject of cults and conspiracy theories help to both understand this and eventually know what to do about it.
Unfortunately, you arguing with them about it most likely did only damage and no good. Stop. It will only make your parents more right wing (and you left) then drive you both crazy.
Here is a good place to start if you like: Hivemind by A.Montell Cultish BA S.cavanagh
Hit me up if you want more. But it’s a complicated subject that can’t be explained in a short lemmy post. If you want any other advice, OP, eatsomeveggies.
My parents immigrated from “communist” Poland years ago and had similar conservative views. Abortion bad, church good, black people lazy, etc… It took years of discussions and disagreement to get them to think in a more progressive way, and yes, having siblings helps. And if you can convince one parent, they can help you convince the other.
I truly believe that art is one of the best ways to alter the way people think. I found that watching movies/documentaries with my parents that had strong ecological and humanitarion viewpoints were a great way to start these discussions. Movies about topics like systemic racism, homophobia, corporate greed/fraud, environmental destruction, religious abuse, etc…
For example, the Netflix documentary ‘13th’ have real insight into how the systemic racism uses poverty to keep marginalized people poor and desperate enough to commit crimes. Which are then blamed on their skin color rather than their on economic situation.
To quote mc Paul Barnum
“They’re scared of change because they are new to it. So don’t demand change on the face. Change can be fluid. Sometimes it’s all right to give up on adults who worked themselves stupid.”
