Linux phones are still behind android and iPhone, but the gap shrank a surprising amount while I wasn’t looking. These are damn near usable day to day phones now! But there are still a few things that need done and I was wondering what everyone’s thoughts on these were:
1 - tap to pay. I don’t see how this can practically be done. Like, at all.
2 - android auto/apple CarPlay emulation. A Linux phones could theoretically emulate one of these protocols and display a separate session on the head unit of a car. But I dont see any kind of project out there that already does this in an open-source kind of way. The closest I can find are some shady dongles on amazon that give wireless CarPlay to head units that normally require USB cables. It can be done, but I don’t see it being done in our community.
3 - voice assistants. wether done on device or phoning into our home servers and having requests processed there, this should be doable and integrated with convenient shortcuts. Home assistant has some things like this, and there’s good-old Mycroft blowing around out there still. Siri is used every day by plenty of people and she sucks. If that’s the benchmark I think our community can easily meet that.
I started looking at Linux phones again because I loathe what apple is doing to this UI now and android has some interesting foldables but now that google is forcing Gemini into everything and you can’t turn it off, killing third party ROMS, and getting somehow even MORE invasive, that whole ecosystem seems like it’s about to march right off a cliff so its not an option anymore for me.
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I fallback to a deGoogled phone precisely because Linux phone isn’t up to my expectation in terms of convenience for now.
You can check my post history but just during the last few days :
- replied to “Why did PinePhone fail” as I have 2 of these https://lemmy.ml/post/35398519/20774482
- discussed on banking apps, authentication bottlenecks on iOS/Android https://lemmy.ml/post/35398519/20854067
… so yes, not there yet
PS: on “assistant” (I really think the naming is over-blowing capabilities) I have been using HomeAssistant daily for years now. I have a Nabu Casu on my shelf… and didn’t even set it up because it was either 3rd party service dependencies (not why I rely on HA) or a very complex setup. So… I would recommend not looking there, at least few months ago when I received mine, sadly.
I don’t really see any of these as deal breakers, because I think the state of Linux phones in 2025 isn’t about being “finished” or “perfect,” it’s about being part of a bigger journey. Every limitation mentioned is just a reflection of where things stand right now, not anything permanent. What kinda excites me is that Linux phones are built around openness, community, and the freedom to adapt, qualities you don’t really get with mainstream options. Sure, there are missing features, rough edges, and some compromises, but none of that outweighs the value of having a device that puts you in control…
While I appreciate that, I really want the freedom to use it that way I want to, not the way others are happy with. It’s open, which makes that theoretically possible, but I’m no Linux dev. I can’t create missing features. So I need to work with what people smarter than me came up with.
I get what you mean. The openness invites possibility, but for a lot of us can feel limiting when we can’t build the missing things ourselves…
Someone did do some work on reimplementing the Android Auto Client Server API.
Just needs time and interest.
God i wish I was smart enough to contribute to these things
Claude code can help
No it can’t. Why would someone maintaining a code base want to read and debug code submitted by someone else who didn’t even bother to write it, especially if I’m not already using Claude code or another vibe code generator.
It’s not too late, I have faith in you
tap to pay, voice assistants, carplay…everything I hate about modern phones. Don’t threaten me with a good time, Linux.
You may not like tap to pay or CarPlay but I and a lot of others do.
It’s a deal breaker for me to not have these two features in a product I’d like to spend hard earned money on.
But those features are not OS implementation issues. They are simply hardware driver issues.
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I already don’t have any of those things on my de-googled android. I’m used to it. Sure, they would be nice, but it’s not a dealbreaker that I have to tap a card instead of my phone, or use Bluetooth instead of carplay, or type on my phone instead of talking to it.
The only thing I was missing without Google was push notifications. And that works out of the box on my /e/ OS FP5. It provides the same API as GSF, but with a different, anonymous push service. I doubt that there will ever be a workaround for Google Pay, because you need the intersection of a well-known company and low level device integration for that to work. And as you say, it’s not a big deal. The Graphene OS guys were pretty smug for a long while about how superior their sandboxed-GSF approach is, but look how that worked out for them. MicroG was always the right idea and if it can’t be done with MicroG it isn’t worth doing (on Android).
I need none of that. Can I run OsmAnd?
By tap to pay, you mean things like Apple pay and Google pay? We don’t have that on degoogled androids, let alone on Linux phones…
But they are still incredibly useful. I do and will put up with a fully-googled phone just for that convenience.
do they come with a surcharge on every payment?
I’ve never seen a surcharge for tap to pay in the US. I’m not sure about elsewhere, but whether I’m tapping my car, my phone, or my watch I have never seen any surcharge from the retailer, my banks, or from Google.
ok that makes things better. Here its like a 1-3% surcharge at some shops while larger shops eat the cost.
We do occasionally see a small surcharge in the US when using a card, but that’s regardless of method (swipe, insert, or tap). Very small businesses will often charge 1-5% for any debit or credit purchase, and cash price is the listed price. But again, that’s not tap specific
I was wondering what everyone’s thoughts on these were:
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It doesn’t work on GrapheneOS either, so I got separate devices I carry with me that do the tap-to-pay instead, and they’ve been a godsend. They’re super compact as well and came for free when I opened the accounts.
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I don’t own a car, on ebike I use my screen.
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Normally I use my fingers. If they’re not available I yell cuss words at my phone until they’re available again.
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huh? which linux phone got useful since you’d stop looking? I run pmOS edge on competent hardware with lotsa RAM and fast storage and that thing isn’t even close to being usable in everyday life.
just basic stuff, like turn it on and it works. the keyboard works. an intuitive UI that you use while walking and dodging other pedestrians. a rock-solid base that doesn’t freeze and stutter with the menial-est of tasks.
the three things you mention couldn’t be farther from my mind if I wanted to.
Fairphone, FLX1, and jolla phones are supposed to be acceptable. They aren’t flagships but they are fine.
My experience too with Linux on phones so far. Really, really want freedom of choice and to be free from Android. It isn’t a real choice if I want a social life and a phone that isn’t a brick.
This is pretty cool, the fact that you can run android apps on Waydroid is awesome. I might try POST-marketos on an old s9 I have lying around.
google is forcing Gemini into everything and you can’t turn it off,
You can still shut off Gemini as of right now. I don’t know what it’ll be like in the future though.
Google said they are going to make it so you can turn off directly interacting with Gemini but it will always be running in the background, spying on you.
That’s North Korean levels of spyware, jfc
“No, it’s okay when we do it”
Source please
First thing I found: https://proton.me/blog/turn-off-gemini-on-android#fully-disable
Oh, I’ve seen that. I’ve had assistant turned off for like 2 years now. It became a security hazard when they took away the sound indicator that it was listening.
Yea they are making it a background process you can’t turn off now and replacing google assistant with it.
I switched to GrapheneOS like 4 years ago and at first I was bummed that I could no longer tap my phone to pay. But it’s fine. I still go out with my wallet in my pocket, so it’s no problem to just tap my bank card really… I’ll take privacy over convenience thanks
I havent taken my wallet with me in years. I prefer tap to pay as it is more secure than a physical card which can get lost or stolen.
Hahahahahaha. No.
Eh, both are about the same level of security, as long as you take the correct actions.
Lose a card? Freeze/Deactivate it and call your bank.
Lose your phone? Use Google/Apple/FindMyDevice (Degoogled) to either find it, or nuke whatever data you had on your phone (hopefully you made backups).
This is the most unhelpful kind of comment where you basically shame someone for having preferences. Why people feel the need to make their callousness public instead of just shutting up, I never know.
Security can be measured objectively. It’s important to call out misinformation.
Security is fundamentally subjective because whatever objective calculus you use will always depend on the threat model at hand, and everyone’s threat model is different, i.e. subjective. I’ve personally lost a physical credit card but never had my card details stolen in 10+ years of using payment apps.
How is a disposable token locked behind passwords and/or biometrics, remotely erasable, unique between each vendor a transaction takes place in inferior to……a string of unchanging digits in a physical card?
You didn’t “call out misinformation.” You laughed at a differing opinion. That’s not an argument. That’s a noise.
Seriously, the Linux community has tons of helpful, super smart people, but mixed in with them are these obnoxious snobs like you that just embarrass the rest of us.
Because phone passwords are usually short and biometrics are public knowledge (usernames, not passwords)
You have a trade off between security and convenience. Phones are devices made for convenience. They are insecure, by design.
So better to have NO passwords or biometrics at all then? Your argument doesn’t make sense.
Missing those things would be a feature for me.
I’m much more worried about having a usable battery life and having basic phone functions like WiFi calling and MMS work.
Tap-to-pay and car assistance are must-have in today’s world. 10-15 years ago, no. Today, yes. Bank apps is the other thing that can’t be done either (because bank apps want a “certified” system to run on). Here in Greece, it’s required you have a bank app on your phone to go with your daily life.
Yes, we all want a simpler life, like it was in the past, so we can envision an OS system that “it’s good enough”. But reality is not on our side. Linux as an open source community phone OS, made by non-commercial/non-corporate entities, can’t be an OS for the masses. It just won’t tick any boxes for them in today’s world. The current Linux phone OSes could be contenders 15 years ago, but not today.
I’ve never used tap to pay. I don’t want any banking info on my phone. In the US, we don’t need any payment apps. Cash and cards work just fine and never run out of battery power.
There’s no way I would ever connect my phone to a modern car with anything other than an aux cable or a bluetooth adapter that plugs into the headphone jack. They gather up all the data they can an do who knows what with it.
The US is not the world though. That’s something Americans need to learn. And having a solution for a single country does not work in the long run for that project. Not in the domain of OSes and phones. Either it’s universal, or it’s doomed to be a niche thing.
The only people that don’t use tap to pay in my area are grannies. And you do seem very old school since the last time I saw an aux cable was 10 years ago.
Are they must haves? I don’t use tap to pay, pretty useless feature for me.
Cars? I don’t want or need android auto. Bluetooth is the only thing I care about.
Navigation on the device is good enough for me, it doesnt need to use the screen.
I have no interest in mobile banking, but that could be an issue if people are used to sending money to each other instantly via a bank app.
If you actually see what needs each country has for phones (by law), and also what needs normal users have, you would change your mind. It’s not just about one user here, one user there that doesn’t need these features, but the whole. I have an e/OS Murena phone (very private foss android fork) for example that I can’t use here in Greece because it doesn’t do banking (the bank app doesn’t work). Additionally, here in Greece we need gov apps (e.g. to get prescriptions, and to not have our ID with us all the time). These don’t run on “foss” versions of android (let alone clear linux OSs).
Yeah that would make me pretty damn angry. What about people who don’t have phones at all, what are they supposed to do?
No country should require the technology of 2 monopolies by law.
Absolutely must haves for me personally, I use each probably daily. I don’t carry any cards with me and exclusively use tap to pay.
Tap to pay is a choice, with a viable alternative.
You could choose to NOT use tap to pay, carry a bank card, and it would have basically no impact on your ability to conduct your life.
But I agree the banking app itself is a big problem, and something that cannot be lived without.
It is a choice, but one that I find important to adopting an alternate. I keep my wallet slim on purpose. Telling people their choices are wrong because you don’t agree with them is not going to get widespread adoption which is important for the long term health and success of such a ambitious project.
Not to berate you but this is a bit of a Linux-pilled response.
Tap to pay and Android auto are conveniences that are of importance to a lot of people. Not everyone chooses to use it, but losing those features will mean Linux phones will exclude a significant proportion of the population that would otherwise be open to using them.
Cards are inconvenient
You can also choose NOT to have a phone at all… Or a bank account.
Just because you personally don’t find something needed doesn’t mean it’s true for others.
Navigating on a 6" screen is pretty annoying after getting used to the larger one.
“must-have” is subjective.
Yes these things are required to achieve wide spread adoption but I personally could do without them.
widespread adoption means you can get things like contributors who will then work on optimising battery life and other fundamentals.
Sure, but I feel like most people in this thread are evaluating what devices are viable for their own personal use right now.
Widespread adoption would be great, but I’m not evaluating whether a device is presently viable for widespread adoption.
I see vo-LTE generally doesn’t work at all either.
I agree that missing these things are features IMO.
Typing this reply from SailfishOS with working VoLTE, MMS and all the things. Occasionally I have to restart a service but overall its pretty good
…they still have Linux phones?
