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Crazy how we have a $1.4T national defense budget and yet we remain powerless in the face of some wind and rain.
Beginning to wonder if the budgets for the F-35A/B/C/D/I, the Virginia Class submarines, and STAR WARS anti-ICBM space laser systems might have been misspent relative to the need for sea walls, dykes, and storm bunkers.
Wind and rain that we knew a century ago how to prevent. The greenhouse effect was discovered during the French Revolution. Catastrophic anthropogenic climate change has been known for about 50 years now.
The thing is handling wind and rain sounds easy until you understand it as force carried through the media of air and water. As a midwesterner I know not to underestimate wind, it can destroy your home without slowing down. This is a bombing campaign of force in a different form.
The thing is handling wind and rain sounds easy until you understand it as force carried through the media of air and water.
But we do have industrial scale infrastructure to curb the effect of these storm surges. We have construction techniques to make buildings more durable. We have artificial breakwaters and coastal preserves to blunt the landfall of these big storms. We have mass transit infrastructure technology to evacuate people quickly and efficiently, rather than stranding them in giant traffic jams in the middle of a storm.
This is a bombing campaign of force in a different form.
We’ve known how to build bunkers for over a century. Perhaps we need a modern day Enver Hoxha in the Florida governor’s seat.
Catastrophic anthropogenic climate change
I prefer anthropogenic runaway global heating (ARGH). “Climate change” is a pretty weak formulation of the underlying problem, even weaker than “global warming”.
It chooses to address the effects rather than the cause. Climate change addresses that it’s not just going to get hotter, we’re also experiencing changes to currents in both the air and water, and things like rainfall are going to wildly change. To some people like folks in Bengal the heat is the problem, but to Albertans the issue is that drier conditions will cause increased wildfires, meanwhile over in the eastern United States it’s hurricanes and tornadoes while Western Europe is going to lose its whole “temperate rainforests at a high latitude” thing as the Gulf Stream collapses.
Oh then things will get real end Permian but that’s more of an atmospheric makeup thing.
Climate change is a phrase created by republican messaging specialist Luntz.
“The climate has always been changing.” I’m sure you’ve heard that dismissal before, no? Not that it matters. Denialists gonna deny. It’s the same people that will see it snow once in the winter and say “so much for global warming.”
Everyone knows immigrants caused climate change anyway.
How about Anthropogenic Catastrophic Kindling (ACK)? Then we can at least get Cathy on board.
What can we make out of LASAGNA to get Garfield involved?
There’s ample money for both. Conservatives just block it.
There’s ample money for both.
glancing at the F-35 $2T budget
At some point, you start making trade offs.
Conservatives just block it.
glancing at the voting records of Manchin, Sinema, and Coons
I wish it was just conservatives.
There’s ample money for both.
I stand by the money comment, there’s zero indication there isn’t money to complete both coastal hardening projects, and robust disaster relief.
I stand by the conservative comment because Manchin and the like are conservative in all but name. More directly, desantis and such openly avoid collaboration with the democratic white house out of spite
I stand by the money comment
That’s fine. But it isn’t just a question of money. Its a question of expertise and manpower. At some point, you have a soft cap on the volume of intellectual and engineering man hours at your disposal. Funneling our best and brightest into a Pentagon vanity project means drawing down the pool of skilled workers in other industries.
It’s the same problem modern mathematics and physics is having with the financials industry. Anyone who excels at high level mathematics gets sucked up to do HFT at some Wall Street hedge fund. They spend their best years combing over market data for optimizing arbitrage in regional commodities prices. The modern day Hawkings and Einsteins are very likely tied up inventing new ways to raid your pension funds, rather than spearheading the next generation of astronomy and physics.
In the same way, the trillions we spend on the F-35 are drawing people into a field that exists exclusively for the cat-and-mouse of perimeter intrusion. Meanwhile, civil engineering is a field for neo-babies looking for government sinecures and B-students who don’t realize they’re getting into a retreating field.
Manchin and the like are conservative in all but name
Conservatives-in-all-but-Name are a big chunk of the party. Manchin isn’t the exception in the Senate, he’s just the name we all recognize. Gillibrand and Hickenlooper and Ossoff and Durbin and King and Tester and on and on… they’re all along for the ride.
DeSantis is a freak on social issues. But on fiscal austerity and “business-friendly” subsidies, he’s right in line with the Dems in his state’s congressional delegation.
I agree with much of your comment but must say I feel you moved the goalposts a bit from raw funds to expertise and manpower. I understand your draw argument, but would contend that it’s not that overlapped a Venn diagram. There aren’t that many aerospace engineer / civil engineer hybrids that you’re losing staff from one to the other.
I feel you moved the goalposts a bit from raw funds to expertise and manpower
When you’re the US Feds, money isn’t real. You can spend 20% of GDP while carrying a $35T debt and nobody cares.
But you still need to spend the money on stuff. You can’t buy a trillion in waffles because that many waffles don’t exist. Similarly, you can’t hire $2T in engineering talent over 10 years without depleting a well of talent shared by other engineering professions.
You’re creating an enormous vacuum in the industry when you can pay 2x-5x what other engineers are making and you’re employing thousands of people for the job over a decade.
There aren’t that many aerospace engineer / civil engineer hybrids
This isn’t a question of “hybrid”. This is a question of “which college has the best graduate salaries?” and “which professors are in the highest demand into the next decade?”
$2T over ten years is it’s own (very lucrative) industry. That’s before you get into the draw this has on electrical engineers and materials specialists and management training.
Our infrastructure is garbage. Our power was out for 2 days last time and Helene barely grazed us. Like one band hit us a bit. This one is heading straight at us so I expect to lose power for a few days at least. DeSantis is a fucking dumb piece of shit. But hey, he refused to talk to Harris to try to score a few political points and the braindead boomers will be going insane with joy.
A few days? Mate, I hope that’s the case, but my experience with direct hits from cat 3+ hurricanes is weeks to months. Only the lucky get it back quickly.
Buckle up. From what you’ve said and my old experience with hurricanes from the past (I live in VA now and we rarely get touched), you’re going to be out of power a week at minimum. I’d bet on much more. If you haven’t already, get whatever supplies you can. I’m sure they’re mostly gone at this point, but if you’re in the path and your ground is already saturated, you’re going to be hurting. Ideally, get the fuck out, but it’s probably too late for that.
Either the money won’t come and she’ll blame Democrats for that, or the money will come despite her and she’ll take credit for it.
“Either the money won’t come and she’ll blame Democrats”
already happening, she must think that the wasted lives will be worth the bad democrats press she squeezes out of it
As is tradition.
it’s the natural way of things for republican politicians
I mean it seems to work for them so it’s unlikely they’ll stop
Is this another non white woman that’s a Republican? Talk about a traitor… Jesus Christ
I was all set to say that a lot of Cubans seem to be so anti communist that they’re pro fascist. But she’s not Cuban. I assumed wrongly. She was born in California.
Talk about a traitor…
To be a traitor, you had to pretend at loyalty to begin with. I don’t see anything in her background to suggest she was ever more than a stooge for the GOP.
That’s very common among Cuban ex-pats. The community is inundated in right-wing revanchism and a burning sense of entitlement and hatred. Every time a liberal US politician tries to reopen diplomatic and trade relations with Cuba, the dead-enders lash out. Every time a conservative promises more sanctions, more embargo, and a tighter siege of the island, they start prepping their boats for Bay of Pigs 2. The Cuban lobby isn’t as bad as AIPAC, but not for lack of trying.
They will still vote for her.
She’s cute so they will back her and continue to vote for her. Florida GOP has figured this out and flexing hard. Run a cute vapid cunt and you’re good.
That’s my rep! 🏳
“God should smite the sinners!”
“Wait, no, not like that!”
Republicans: As long as it hits Democrats too…
Reminded of the aftermath of Ida, during which the wealthier districts in Mississippi and Alabama got immediate and substantive bailouts while the poorer municipalities were left to rot.
It’s happened before, it will happen again. Your proximity to power will determine the relief you receive.
All so they can say, “Look how little the Biden administration is doing for the people of Florida!”
Literally putting life and property on the chopping block for their political posturing.
She should go stand on the beach and try and stop it with thoughts and prayers
Agreed. She should put on her best “American flag” or “Make America Great Again” bikini/swimsuit and livestream herself praying the storm away.
Tampa Bay and Orlando are two of the largest tourist cities in the state. I’m curious to see what the honorable representatives from Disney and Universal Studios are going to say in the aftermath of this thing.
I would laugh my ass off if Disney World (or Disney Land or whatever it’s called, I’m not American) got destroyed.
If Disney is destroyed, the federal government will earmark a billion dollars to rebuild it.
Tear down this Magic Kingdom and Walt’s Ghost (plus an enormous traunch of taxpayer money) will see it rebuilt in three days.
Disneyland is in California, Disneyworld is in Florida.
Source: I live near Disneyland
Id wager the park would be mostly fine, Its in the center of the
panhandlelong part that extends off the continent which should be the thing we call the pandhandle so the hurricane has to cover alot of ground to cover before it reaches it in force. Most likely looking at alot of damage to window and facades, with some flooding damage.Source: I am a stranger on the internet doing guesswork and gutfeels on a natural phenomenon I’ve never experienced myself.
Edit: God damn… Disneyworld is like dead center in this hurricanes path. They’re about to get wrecked.
Disney World is in the center if the Penninsula, not the panhandle. it’s in Orlando not Tallahassee.
TIL: the panhandle in the term Florida Panhandle refers to the bit in red and not the bit in white. I will take no responsibility for this error and argue that the term is worded horribly. Its clear as day to me that this white bit is the handle of the us, hanging off its end like a dong…
I don’t think “panhandle” has a strict definition but it tends to mean a bit of a state that sticks out into what rightfully should be another state. Oklahoma’s panhandle is the most obvious example of one. West Virginia has two. Florida’s panhandle is the part that should be Alabama’s coastline.
What if this time instead of being decent, we just don’t send aid. Too long we have let these voters elect these tools without consequences. They don’t want aid? We shouldn’t send it. Helping regardless sends the exact wrong message.
Because we have ethics and they don’t. Also because a lot of innocent people would die, not just republicans. I’m a queer socialist in a red state as are many of my friends. It sucks but it’s where we’re from and it’s not the easiest thing for everyone to find a job in a better area.
Because what the fuck, innocent people will die? People that didn’t vote for whoever this dumb sack of shit is?
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It’s coastal Florida, hurricanes are inevitable.
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They shouldn’t need emergency help because they should have evacuated. Evacuation orders were issued Monday.
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Why should the rest of us subsidize their poor choice of living location? If you cannot afford adequate insurance, then you shouldn’t live there. The cost of insurance should reflect the actual risk and not rely on taxpayer subsidy.
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We have helped in the past, and it hasn’t fixed the fundamental problem - see point 1.
It’s different to send aid to Asheville, hurricanes aren’t really expected to destroy elevated inland town. Coastal Florida should expect this weather.
Poor planning on their part shouldn’t constitute an emergency for the rest of us.
You need to shut the fuck up and sit down.
Is it considered tacky to keep the plywood up year-round?
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Because in my version of America we look out for each other, even the assholes who don’t subscribe. Helping regardless sends exactly the right message.
People can and do come around (especially young people) when they see you as the helpers rather than the rival tribe. One of the biggest stumbling blocks for Democrats - particularly in a state like Florida or Michigan or Pennsylvania - is how often they see politicians shower the state with attention in the six weeks before election day and then forget it exists as soon as the voting is done.
Another is the way both parties seem slavishly loyal to the biggest corporate interests in the respective states, despite groundswells of opposition to their gestapo-like municipal controls. The history of Disney in Florida is straight out of the most vile dystopian libertarian bullshit imaginable, straight down to Disney security officer collectable “challenge coins”.
This is refreshing to read. I wish the rest of the US thought the same
About half of us do. But that’s not enough.
This is refreshing to read.
You said it. I’ve lived in Florida my whole life, and I’m situated in the current path of Milton (on the east coast). Lemmy, and this thread in particular, is peppered with comments rooting for an entire state’s worth of countrymen to die in an imminent natural disaster, or be excommunicated, because some portion of the electorate is too ignorant or brainwashed to vote in their own best interests. It’s gross and un-American.
Good luck, countryman. We’re with you.
Let’s compromise on aid… Brought To You By Joe Biden!
One of the savvier moves Trump made was to show up at every disaster scene with a campaign bus and a t-shirt cannon. He made a spectacle of every relief effort. He personally put his name on the COVID tax-relief checks. Consequently, he continues to be one of the most popular candidates to run for President.
Meanwhile, Biden took office in 2021 and immediately started compromising with his rightward flank. He billed everything as “Bipartisan”. He traded away child tax credit extensions and Medicaid expansion to Senators in his own party as a condition for bailing out Intel and sending more weapons to Israel. Miserable politics. Deplorable approval ratings. He went the full Lyndon Johnson at the end, dropping out without even trying for reelection.
They know exactly what they are doing. They are going to blame the President. They don’t care about their own people.
They’re already blaming him.
Because their people will blame the President too.
There was recent shift in polls in Florida, making it a tossup state, I’m wondering if that vote by Republicans could have something to do with it.
Polls aren’t very indicative of election results in a state with as much voter suppression as Florida.
There’d probably have to be at least 10% more voting age Dems than Republicans to make it competitive.
What if a few rural counties get washed into the ocean?
reference please? i havent seen anything except florida being up rep by a good bit
then there is also this from NYTimes, further confounding things
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/10/08/upshot/florida-poll-harris-trump.html
thanks. Id be astounded and delighted if harris can win florida, but you never know.
that article is all over the place. it links back to itself (clicking the poll link takes you to a link for that headline)… I was able to find the actual poll: https://napolitaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/10/GCM24-FL09-Mini-Crosstabs-Pres.pdf
The Harris campaign should be running 24/7 ads about how they reached out to DeSantis to offer aid and he refused to take the call.
Is she living in that district, though?
Why would a maga rep actually live near the people they represent? They are grifters, not actual representatives of anyone. I’d be surprised if she even lives in Florida at all.
My point exactly
Lived in Panama City Beach during Hurricane Michael (2018). GOP mayor stole funds from hurricane relief, used them to hold parties on yaughts, bought a new house in Jacksonville and finally got sentenced… To 1 month in jail.
Side note: when Trump came down to see the damage in Panama City Beach/Panama City/down to Tyndall Air Force Base, he only wanted to go with her, not the mayors of either of those 2 cities.
I find it frustrating that she’s so blazingly hot and simultaneously such an incredibly ugly person. I was explaining this to my girl, and she said “she’s like the female Josh Hawley.”
Yes, I immediately criticized her for saying he’s hot, he looks like a goober d-bag to me. But, she pointed out, as a hetero man my vision isn’t clouded by his looks, so all I see is the pure, Emperor Palpatine evilness of him.
She thinks he’s evil too, but a good-looking evil apparently.
I can see his attractiveness to some extent, but I think it’s mostly that he’s an average looking dude of relative youth in comparison to his colleagues in the Senate. Put most men in a well-tailored suit and you’ll set at least some hearts aflutter. Give him time and his lich core will take over.
And yeah, she looks like your typical Fox News broadcaster who has been chosen primarily due to their pretty face and ability to spread vitriol with reckless abandon.
