- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
Summary
U.S. Muslim leaders who supported Trump to protest Biden’s stance on Gaza and Lebanon now feel betrayed by Trump’s pro-Israel Cabinet picks.
His appointments of Marco Rubio as Secretary of State, Mike Huckabee as ambassador to Israel, and Elise Stefanik as UN ambassador have drawn sharp criticism, with some accusing the administration of pursuing “Zionist overdrive” and “neoconservative” priorities.
Rabiul Chowdhury, a Philadelphia investor who chaired the “Abandon Harris” campaign and co-founded “Muslims for Trump,” and Rexhinaldo Nazarko, executive director of AMEEN, feel betrayed by broken promises of peace.
“It’s like he’s going on Zionist overdrive,” said Nazarko, adding, “it does look like our community has been played.”
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They didn’t think the leopard would eat THEIR face.
“It’s like he’s going on Zionist overdrive,” said Nazarko, adding, “it does look like our community has been played.”
You literally played yourself. No help from Trump. I can’t think of a single goddamn thing he’s said that was even vaguely pro-Palestine. Jesus Christ.
I have utmost dislike in saying this, but: “ha, suckers”
No ‘ha’ here from me. It’s just sad. And infuriating.
Fair point
I actually think it was Russia pushing a lot of this again. It’s exactly what they did to us Bernie supporters the last time we got the trump
This is what I’ve been saying all along. The Abandon Harris movement was orchestrated to disillusion voters and make them stay home. Just like what happened with Bernie bros.
The logic of it was completely flawed. And every argument about how strategic voting is important under first-past-the-post, and how Trump would certainly be a worse choice on the subject of Israeli genocide, was met with “maybe you can support genocide, but I can’t.” Which didn’t address the issue at hand at all.
Our country is full of rubes of all shapes, sizes, and colors. Some fall for Trump’s rhetoric and vote for him, others fall for shit like this and don’t vote.
I think we should really stop blaming Russian propaganda and focus on blaming ourselves. There’s too large a portion of the US population who lap up easily refuted news and opinions. Russia didn’t make Americans stupid we did. Russia didn’t divide America, its been divided since its creation.
I think there is plenty of blame to go around. In fact, I think the problem since the election has been that people refuse to admit that. As if there has to be one single entity you can point your finger at to blame everything on.
And certainly don’t consider yourself culpable in any way, shape or form.
I mean I consider myself culpable and I voted for Harris. But I also didn’t do anything to convince any of my neighbors to do it. I never phone banked or anything.
And yet somehow the “don’t vote for Harris because genocide” people think they have absolutely nothing to do with people not voting for Harris and it’s certainly not their fault in any way that she lost.
There is always a bunch of relevant factors in the outcome of a national election. It’s the job of the candidate to overcome those hurdles. If they don’t, then they were the wrong candidate. It’s not about blame, it’s about how we do better next time.
I’d much prefer that Harris won, but it does warm my heart a bit that the Democratic establishment got fucked for their manipulation of the 2020 primary and subsequent forcing of a Harris run. If we are talking blame, then that’s where it belongs. Fuck the Clintons, Obama, Biden, Pelosi, Schumer, and the rest of the DNC corporate lineup.
What next time?
All of you people who have been saying that the Democrats need to learn their lesson for next time need to come to terms with the fact that come January, you will be living in a fascist dictatorship.
Until the next election is cancelled, I will be working under the assumption that it will happen. Fuck that defeatist crap.
Have fun with that. I won’t be with you to wait and see if that happens. There’s a reason that there’s almost no one on the German side of my family tree.
All Russia did was push a narrative. The people that chose to believe it over unbiased news sources, friends and family, republicans, and their own eyes and ears watching Trump are fucking idiots.
Doesn’t his Sec of Defense nominee have a Deus Vult tattoo? Yeah, that doesn’t bode well…
kagis
https://forward.com/fast-forward/675325/pete-hegseth-tattoos-christian-crusades-trump/
One of Hegseth’s most prominent tattoos is a large Jerusalem cross on his chest, a symbol featuring a large cross potent with smaller Greek crosses in each of its four quadrants. The symbol was used in the Crusades and represented the Kingdom of Jerusalem that the Crusaders established.
Hegseth also has “Deus Vult,” Latin for “God wills it,” tattooed on his bicep. The phrase was used as a rallying cry for the First Crusade in 1096. It is also the closing sentence of Hegseth’s 2020 book, titled “American Crusade.”
Hegseth also has a cross and sword tattooed on his arm, which he says represents a New Testament verse. The verse, Matthew 10:34, reads, “Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth; I have not come to bring peace, but a sword.”
He later added “Yeshua,” or Jesus in Hebrew, under the sword. Hegseth told the site Media Ink in a 2020 interview that the tattoo was Jesus’ Hebrew name, which he mistakenly said was “Yehweh,” a Biblical spelling of God’s name. He told Media Ink that he got the tattoo while in Bethlehem, Jesus’ birthplace, which is located in the present-day West Bank, where he was reporting for Fox Nation.
“Israel, Christianity and my faith are things I care deeply about,” Hegseth told Media Ink.
Hegseth opposes the two-state solution and supports exclusive Israeli sovereignty in the Holy Land. He has also said the idea of rebuilding the biblical Temple on Jerusalem’s Temple Mount is a “miracle” that could happen in our lifetimes. The First and Second Temples stood on a site where the Dome of the Rock, an Islamic shrine, now stands.
Hegseth expressed these views in a 2018 speech delivered in Jerusalem at a conference organized by the right-wing Israel National News, also known as Arutz Sheva.
The speech laid out a vision of a world beset by a growing darkness that can only be saved by the United States, Israel and fellow “free people” from other countries.
The amusing thing is that OP’s article didn’t even get to him because it was talking about other nominations.
This is my favorite part:
“I was in the National Guard during the inauguration of Joe Biden, so I served under Bush, served under Obama, served under Trump, and now was going to guard the inauguration because I was in the D.C. guard,” he told Fox in June. “Ultimately, members of my unit in leadership deemed that I was an extremist or a white nationalist because of a tattoo I have, which is a religious tattoo. It’s a Jerusalem cross. Everybody can look it up, but it was used as a premise to revoke my orders to guard the inauguration.”
GUUUUYS! I’m not a white supremacist, I’m a Christian supremacist!
…
Why are you all looking at me like that?
These goddamned fucking idiots. This stupid country deserves every comeuppance it gets from this clown administration.
Lol
This should be in [email protected].
Maybe [email protected] is better
I would argue it should go in imatotalfuckingmoron@onlydumbfuckswhocantread
Lol get fucked losers.
I’m done feeling sorry for dumbasses that shoot themselves in the foot then complain about the pain. Shut the fuck up and lay in the bed of shit you made.
“Muslim leaders” who the fuck are even these people. a Philadelphia investor? yeah I bet he’s super religious. gtfoh
Hassan Abdel Salam, a former professor at the University of Minnesota, Twin Cities and co-founder of the Abandon Harris campaign, which endorsed Green Party candidate Jill Stein, said Trump’s staffing plans were not surprising, but had proven even more extreme that he had feared.
A professor even. They knew less about the coming administration than my uneducated ass whose not even residing in the country where all that is happening.
A Philadelphia investor who chaired the Abandon Harris campaign in Pennsylvania and co-founded Muslims for Trump.
You didn’t need to be religious to be a religious leader.
Sure seems weird that this level of glee over predictable bad things happening seem hyperfocused on the racial out group with the best reason to vote emotionally.
Then maybe they should have listened when they were told that this was the exact literal consequence of voting emotionally.
And people in the community were warning for months that this was the consequence of refusing to denounce genocide. But somehow you only want to blame the racial and religious out group who can’t even be credibly blamed for losing the election. You guys were claiming for months they weren’t important and should be ignored, and now that the election is over and the thing Democratic leaders were warning of happened, suddenly it’s all their fault?
And people in the community were warning for months that this was the consequence of refusing to denounce genocide
And they were told, repeatedly, that Trump would be worse. Guess what happens now?
But somehow you only want to blame the racial and religious out group who can’t even be credibly blamed for losing the election.
Trump improved his margin across nearly every single demographic, so there’s plenty of blame to go around. But in a comment thread about Muslim voters feeling buyer’s remorse, I’m not going to talk about the white men who get fed shit from the manosphere podcast space, or the ghost of Phyllis Schlafly infecting women across this country to vote for the party that wants to take their rights away, or that when Trump was talking about Latino immigrants he was talking about them and not those other immigrants. It’s called “context.”
You guys were claiming for months they weren’t important and should be ignored
Nope, didn’t say that. I said that when your choice is token lip service about maybe stopping Palestinian genocide, and making the genocide worse, that you should vote for the former, because otherwise you’ll get the latter. Which is what happened. Congratulations, you told the Dems you weren’t going to vote for them, and now are surprised they ignored what you wanted.
Congratulations, you told the Dems you weren’t going to vote for them, and now are surprised they ignored what you wanted.
This is such a completely broken and backward way to think about politics, but even so, the entire time representatives from that community (Democrats trying to get Harris elected) were trying to get them to do anything to head this off. At no point was there a “well, we’re just never going to vote for you so look elsewhere”, but that didn’t stop the campaign for prioritizing literal Republicans over previously Democratic constituencies with unsurprisingly bad results.
And I am a non-Muslim Harris voter, but this liberal tendency to blame minorities for the failures of existing power structures cannot be suppressed.
I personally agreed with undecided in principle and was sympathetic that Harris largely ignored them. The problem is that trying to leverage their position for actual good policy outcomes made for this nasty prisoner’s dilemna situation where both parties chose the bad option.
I honestly thought that they’d eventually come around because of just how bad Trump was going to be for democracy, and moreover for the people they cared about. Sadly, they were so devoted to their game of chicken that some of their loved ones will pay for it.
I also don’t think it’s that callous to engage in a little bit of “I fucking told you so.”
Most people I saw here were just trying to achieve the most favourable outcome, given the reality at the time.
I honestly thought that they’d eventually come around because of just how bad Trump was going to be for democracy, and moreover for the people they cared about. Sadly, they were so devoted to their game of chicken that some of their loved ones will pay for it.
The problem in this is that you can substitute either the Harris campaign or the Muslim voters for “they”, and far too few people are applying it to the people with power. It seems inconceivable to these people that politicians actually need to address the concerns of the people they want to vote for them. They’re like some sort of unknowable force without agency or responsibility. It’s always the little guy’s fault for not coming around to the whims of the politician.
What makes it all worse is that on one side you have a population with good reason to be acting emotionally and the other you have someone just making a calculation that they just didn’t think they were worth it. Everyone shares blame for this result, but I get acting emotionally when you’re being ignored by power while they send weapons to kill your families. I don’t have any grace for sociopathic Democrats who would rather chase Republicans than take a moral stance for a constituency that voted for them in the past.
The problem in this is that you can substitute either the Harris campaign or the Muslim voters for “they”
Lol! You’re absolutely right. From my point of view, though, the democratic party is so fully captured and out of touch with actual issues that they’re beyond being reasoned with, so it should almost go without saying who I’m referring to. And yes, I acknowledge how completely fucked that is.
They’ve created this absolutely monstrous situation where we always have to choose between letting people we care about get hurt, or a tiny glimmer of hope of something better, and even though I pushed to avoid the former, I’m fully sympathetic to both sides.
I think the masses of voters who are much less easy to influence. They’re not on Lemmy debating the topic or waiting for a community leader to decide the strategy. They probably didn’t even do any sort of deep game theory about playing chicken and scaring the Democrats. They just got more pissed off as the news came through, as the Democrats made excuses and acted like nothing needed to change, and as people in their community reported deaths. We can debate and shout and rationalize here all we want, we can suppress the topic for the greater good, and all that will have zero impact on electorate-level perceptions. They’re not here, there are too many for us to individually convince to change their mind, and they’re probably not even open to listening to a coldly rational argument about lesser evils and other topics.
Even the people organizing these campaigns didn’t have the influence to change their votes. Uncommitted endorsed Harris! But the whole thing was never in their control. They can only report the temperature they’re feeling in the community and suggest moves they think would help get people back into the tent. Those Democratic operatives and elected officials should have the potential to influence Harris. They have names people know, and phone numbers to people of importance. If she was so corrupt and blocked off that even they couldn’t reach her then we kind of do need the reckoning that could come from such an abject failure to keep the coalition together. There’s no “push her to be better after the election” in that case.
So they should’ve listened to Bill Clinton instead, who went to Dearborn and essentially said Israel can do whatever they want to their faces? There were no good options to vote for.
I didn’t think Bill Clinton could run for a third term.
He was a campaign surrogate.
And he’s also a human being with his own opinions.
Maybe they should have listened to the woman running for president instead. I’m not sure why that idea didn’t occur to you.
If the campaign didn’t want Bill Clinton there, he wouldn’t have gone. This was their campaign strategy, along with hanging out with Cheney.
The Democrats ran an awful campaign again, and they need to stop blaming the voters for reacting negatively to this.
You asked who they should have listened to. I told you the person they should have listened to. The person actually running for office.
I have no idea why you think they should have not paid attention to what the person running for office said and just took for granted what her surrogate said agreed with what she said. That’s a pretty ignorant thing to do, not take a few moments to check and see what her actual beliefs on this are and if they’re being represented accurately.
So I guess we’ll put you down on the “pro-ignorance” list. I guess that’s why you seem to be okay with Trump winning.
My dude, nobody said there was a good option. The choice was a bad option, and a much worse option. Bill Clinton doesn’t matter since he has nothing to do with the government. Harris at least paid lip-service to stopping Israel; Trump said he wants Bibi to “finish the job.”
And the kicker is, one of those two choices was going to win and if you don’t vote for the bad option, the much worse option wins by default.
Unfortunately, this whole election can be summed up as: everyone not named Trump voted against their best interests.
When it comes to this issue, you can’t really say that Trump is that much worse. Either way Gaza and the West Bank were heading to oblivion. Rhetoric aside, there is no evidence that Harris would have ever stood up to Israel in any meaningful way.
When it comes to this issue, you can’t really say that Trump is that much worse.
Oh my sweet summer child… It can always be worse.
seem hyperfocused
My dude my feed is literally just leopards eating faces right now. It will continue to be for the next four years. Trump’s presidency only benefits the worst of our society, it will just take some voters longer to feel the pain than others
In my feed this story has shown up multiple times (more than any other group), each with a cavalcade of engagement, and “haha, more genocide” statements show up on every story about Palestine. They’re the group with the best excuse for “well that was dumb, but I get it” (their families are literally being killed by American weapons), but despite being marginalized as small and unimportant for months are now being covered as the post facto cause of failure, without anyone even recognizing that this was being predicted by Democratic party members well in advance as the obvious result of just trying to ignore the genocide.
but despite being marginalized as small and unimportant for months are now being covered as the post facto cause of failure,
Where are they blamed for the failure of the campaign here, again?
without anyone even recognizing that this was being predicted by Democratic party members well in advance as the obvious result of just trying to ignore the genocide.
The obvious result was that a not-insignificant part of the country is stupid enough to vote for ‘more genocide’ instead of less?
The whole premise of this being a news story, and a story that receives reliable engagement and gets injected into every story about Lebanon and Palestine is that these votes of these people have meaningfully caused the problems we’re all going to experience. A similar amount of ink is not being spread about any other group, and certainly not about all the mundane white assholes who have been voting for the people who harm their communities year after year.
And be honest, we’re looking at like 5% more genocide than Biden. We aren’t exactly going from Gandhi to Hitler on this issue. The Harris opportunity was always a secret hope that she was better than what she was willing to say. And like, a hope is better than none at all, but if she just followed what she said and didn’t change anything, none of us would be seriously asking ourselves how we could have missed the signs.
The whole premise of this being a news story, and a story that receives reliable engagement and gets injected into every story about Lebanon and Palestine is that these votes of these people have meaningfully caused the problems we’re all going to experience.
That’s a lot of reading in to a common post-election story of buyer’s remorse that’s all over the place, about multiple demographics, right now.
And be honest, we’re looking at like 5% more genocide than Biden.
Lord.
Junkies’ll do some crazy shit for some o’ that sweet, sweet righteous indignation…
There are over a million Gazans still alive. That is a very large number of people barely hanging on from starvation that can still be mercilessly wiped out. You really sure about that 5% figure?
I’m more disturbed by the fact that they think that 5% figure is irrelevant. Even if they’re right, that’s 5% more innocent people. That’s literally thousands of people.
Biden literally isn’t stopping the starvation tactic now. There was a red line, they crossed it, and he said “nevermind”. So what exactly is going to be different under Trump? From another story, Trump is going to release the 2000 lb. bomb shipments. It’s literally the only thing Biden has denied them. I’d estimate 5% is the difference is between killing people with starvation, disease, and 500 lb. bombs and starvation, disease, and 2000 lb. bombs.
I hope I’m wrong, but I expect the difference being going from a small handful of aid trucks a day to zero aid trucks a day. That would be a big difference to the people of Gaza.
And be honest, we’re looking at like 5% more genocide than Biden.
Let’s say that’s true. I don’t believe it’s true, but let’s say it is… that’s worse, right? Would you go to Palestine and tell people there “only 5% more of you will die now that Trump has been elected, so it’s about the same as before?”
What a crazy bit of hand waving away a huge problem of your own admission.
I’m not counting bodies, I’m saying the relative dedication to genocide is not significantly different in impact. The material difference from Biden is literally just the 2000 lb. bombs, with an unquantifiable and unreliable hope that Democrats would snap out of it and start doing better. Hope meant it was worth trying for, because a change could be a big deal, but very likely the real difference in death come January 20th is going to be minimal compared to the death that Biden has already overseen and allowed.
I’m not counting bodies, I’m saying the relative dedication to genocide is not significantly different in impact.
That’s literally counting bodies. Even if your 5% figure is right, that’s a difference in thousands of deaths.
Again, would you say such a thing to someone in Gaza? That thousands more dead than there would have been otherwise is not significantly different in impact? Would you say it to a parent who’s child was amongst those thousands?
In my feed this story has shown up multiple times (more than any other group), each with a cavalcade of engagement, and “haha, more genocide” statements show up on every story about Palestine.
Well that certainly isn’t happening on Lemmy, so maybe you should stay out of such a toxic environment. It’s Twitter, isn’t it?
Can you please link to and quote one of two of the people you think are laughing about more genocide?
That’s what I did. Here’s two in easy form:
Topic: “Israeli drones shooting children in Gaza deliberately ‘day after day’, UK surgeon tells MPs”:
You know what would help this situation? Letting a fascist become President of the United States. Again.
Topic: “Continuing ‘Ethnic Cleansing’ Campaign, Israel Blows Past US Deadline for Gaza Aid”
Don’t worry, just like how it was only fair that Ukraine and American minorities get genocided if Gaza was going to get genocided, abstaining voters have likewise decided it’s only fair for the West Bank to suffer genocide if Gaza is going to suffer genocide.
Current genocide happening, but let’s instead talk about how it’s somehow going to be worse in January because the real importance is the election.
Neither of those people are laughing about more genocide. In any way. You do know the difference between laughing about something and cynicism, right? Because those are both the latter.
I don’t believe for one second that these “muslim leaders” care one iota about Palestine or Gaza. They care about the money Orange promised them. This is just posturing and fake outrage to cover their ass.
What money?
If only there was any way to have seen this coming based on literally every single thing he’s said and done over the last decade!
And good luck protesting with Noem heading DHS along with SCOTUS’s ruling.
It’s so sad, but pointing this out as an obvious consequence would have been bullying. of course, and immediately shot down as such.
I was called a racist for having the gall to criticize the Muslim movement to not vote Harris.
Me calling white christians stupid for voting for Trump because it actually hurts them is OK. But calling Muslims stupid for voting 3rd party or abstaining because it actually hurts them is racist.
It’s insane, honestly. An old coworker of mine who I sometimes stay in touch with is Muslim, and a Trump supporter. I’ve tried to figure out why, since Trump has never shown any meaningful support of Muslims, and all he could say is that the economy was good under Trump. Like… was having gas be $0.08 cheaper really worth having your actual family banned from entering the country? Not only was he already living paycheck-to-paycheck under Trump and still under Biden, but he was literally directly affected by Trump’s Muslim ban. I don’t know how you justify that with yourself.
It’s simple. Kamala said it’s ok to be gay.
Jup. I saw interviews with muslim Trump voters saying exactly that.
Don’t you know that pointing out the obvious consequences of electing trump before the election was actually supporting genocide?
“don’t tell Muslims what to do” is what I would get every time I’d point out that Trump will do far worse.
Idiots.
Trump’s peace promises…
You can’t have conflict if only one side survives…
I’d like to think Trump & Co don’t think that way.
I’d like to.
Wait, voting for the face eating leopards party isn’t going to work out for them? "I am sure the openly racist party is not talking about me specifically. " Wait until they see the plans to deport them back to the front lines of the genocide.
Heh. They sure will be greatly astonished once the first US troops ship to Israel. It’s OK, because Israel is not in the NATO.
