I’m in my mid 20s, and an atheist. I remember back in 2014, when I was an edgy little shit, I thought once people lost religion, as per the trend, people would be nicer to each other and science would rule the day. Probably a naive thought.
Yet, it feels like nothing is sacred anymore. Everywhere you look it’s just people trying to get their slice of the pie, ethics be damned. Everything feels like it’s going badly. I’ve just graduated and the job market is full of time wasting rituals. It just feels like people have lost touch with decency and community. No one has any pride in what they do.
Correlation != causation of course, and so the decline in religion may not be the cause. Still I wonder if for a certain segment of the population, those that seem to thrive and filter to the top of our wonderful society, the fear of damnation was check on their base impulses.
Or if perhaps this is a part of the process, perhaps the reasonable people have all left the churches leaving an ever growing concentration of barbarous individuals holding the reins of that decrepit institution.
Or it’s just the lack of community that religion once forced upon us, to see and be civil, if not caring for those in our immediate geographic community that hold differing opinions from us. A moderating influence if you will.
It’s a good question. Obviously the answer is “no” in the narrow sense. Most genuine atheists are not going to spontaneously start believing supernatural dogma just because it’s good for them.
the fear of damnation was check on their base impulses.
This is a double-edged sword. If some people are not doing bad things simply for fear of cosmic comeback, then they might also do bad things for other irrational reasons. Think suicide bombers. It’s the Voltaire quote: “Those who can persuade us to believe absurdities can make us commit atrocities.”
About damnation specifically, personally I’m with Dawkins on that one: this kind of belief can only ever begin in childhood, and to frighten children with threats of hellfire and damnation is a form of child abuse. I’m certainly pleased nobody ever did that to me.
Or it’s just the lack of community that religion once forced upon us, to see and be civil, if not caring for those in our immediate geographic community that hold differing opinions from us.
Yep I think it’s this. Religion is above all a forum for community. What we’re missing is community.
religion is a bandaid for vicious wounds
Fuck No!
People. Family, friends, neighbors. Connect with real people. Not some con that’s fooled countless people into giving away their $$ for fake promises and false “gods”.
It should never be “Do we need religion?”, it should be “Do I need religion?”. Some people might need it, but it doesn’t need to be pressed upon others.
Also religion or no religion, assholes will be assholes. Even if all religion disappeared from the world like it was never there, number of assholes in the world won’t change.
Assholes don’t need an excuse to be one.
That’s also very true, unfortunately.
religion was never the issue. the issue is people being stupid and lacking morals, which they will do and justify regardless of the situation.
I’m much to lazy to post the two spacemen meme. Just because you are finally aware of something doesn’t mean it just happened.
Are you saying that people have always been like this or?
Si
Is faith your last resort?
What is faith son of man?
You will really enjoy reading Max Weber’s the Protestant ethic. I think that’s the title. It’s about how Protestant values on work worked really well with the new capitalism and how the values were maintained but god was removed. Highly recommend.
There are plenty of good reads on the sacred. I personally find it odd that you as an atheist have an idea of the sacred. Could you define it?
For community I definitely feel nothing beats religious communities. But it’s not a religion to religion basis but community.
I will take a look it sounds like an interesting read!
In looking at the definition of sacred I can agree with your confusion, as it seems rather tied in with religion. However, I’ll take the last definition from Webster and say that I mean something that is unassailable, highly valued and important.
While I may not believe in a god, we humans have a penchant for stories, stories passed down through generations which convey some useful truths. Perhaps in a very analytical view we can say that ideals such as: fairness, decency, responsibility, and fidelity are expressions of an evolutionarily advantageous strategy of community building.
Yet, while this may be the underlaying truth, on the day to day it is the feelings of righteous giddiness I get when I read of an ideal that I know to be good and just. While acknowledging the impact of my default wiring and upbringing, I believe we all can choose our moral framework, and live by it.
Here are some brief thoughts on this :)
Thanks for defining and explaining. Based on your last paragraph you seem to have an interest in traditions/religions/or philosophies of life. I recently TA-ed for an undergraduate course which discussed what it means to have a good life. The course went through various religious and philosophical traditions pushing students to question what they value.
It seems like your interest in these values for your self as well as hope to see change in the world.
I would personally recommend you read through traditions and see what is interesting or affects your personal values :)
Some content you may enjoy include:
- scholar of religion https://m.youtube.com/@ReligionForBreakfast
- unknown credentials but interesting guy https://m.youtube.com/@LetsTalkReligion
- podcast on philosophy I enjoyed in undergrad https://www.philosophizethis.org/
If it adds anything, I personally went from culturally Christian, to radically Christian and maybe somewhat conservative, to being open to eastern religions in undergrad and becoming Buddhist.
That stage of radically challenging my Christianity really made me a better person. It made me more able to challenge my beliefs and see values as important not something to be enforced.
Finally, I want to comment on reading various traditions though as you appear to be more interested in values and the separate you may not find this important. I personally find it harmful to just randomly mix traditions. There certainly are living examples of common and uncommon traditions that frequently mix but I firmly believe the modern day hippie who randomly mixes values and cosmologies creates a weaker system for themselves then if they stuck to the one most applicable. That said, in China it was and is rare for common practitioners to see going to the Buddhist temple one day then the Dalits shrine the other an issue.
Maybe a different form of religion. Not based on a guy with a long white beard but a force that created and keeps order in the universe.
Or just humanity in its entirety.
Religion is useful for one thing and one thing only - as a barrier to depression. Having a predefined higher purpose neutralizes the existential dread, it helps you function in the face of a meaningless life.
Unfortunately it’s all false. Once you understand the the falsehood it doesn’t help any more. Which is why so many religious people cling to their religion. Giving up on whatever belief kept them alive equals suicide, and they want to keep on living.
Did you notice all the harm Trump has caused in his first 24h because evangelical christo-fascists love and vote for him?
No. Religion is toxic.
My interest you in the gospel of solar punk? Praise the sun!
Religion is a tool. We just need to fix the message.
Unless you’re George Carlin worshipping Joe Pesci, religion sucks for society.
if everyone was like super chill like buddy Jesus, I’d beg to differ. It’d just for some reason religious people are not trying to be like Christ. Has religion failed us? Yes. Could we use it to spread the love of Solarpunk christ? Also yes.
I’m a Preacher’s kid, now an atheist. But I have been wondering the same thing. It’s interesting I am not alone in that. In the last week I have seen the subject come up twice, once in this post and once at The Free Press.
religion = smarmy cruel assholes
It is a problem with scrolling (social) media. I’ve proved that one to myself, yet still struggle to disconnect more.
How did you prove it to yourself? I think this might be the case, but curious if I might replicate your experiment.
Just take a week or two off and disconnect. See how your motivations and productivity change. Compare what you were doing before social media and now and be honest about who you are and who you were.
while community is desperately needed, religion is a con to control humans. the idea of the divine is utterly absurd and has no place in the modern world.
