Linked National Post on purpose. Given their bias I believe they’d present the worst case scenario.
E: Apparently the article is from 2016 so the cost is likely higher today.
https://www.saab.com/markets/canada/gripen-for-canada/built-for-canada-by-canada
From another page:
“In addition, Canada will have full and exclusive control over Gripen’s secure data – a unique advantage of our offer. The Gripen Centre in Montreal will host all work on the fighter’s mission system and Canadians will carry out this work. With the mission system, communications and technical data all hosted in Canada, Gripen exceeds all industrial, security and controlled goods requirements. With Gripen the Royal Canadian Air Force will have maximum control over sensitive data handling.”
It’s a no brainer, in a world of digital warfare, needing to rely on a foreign home base is a tremendous liability.
How are they the only ones offering that, that needs to be table stakes to even bid
Because we live in capitalist dictatorships masquerading as freedom™️ and democracy™️
But we assumed it was ok till recently? How was it ever ok?
Ford blew twice that to put beer in gas stations. Clearly we have the money to blow 🤡
These are numbers from 2016. Is there any place where we can read these contracts? Maybe with the current situation, conditions are changing. Hopefully, people put a clause in case of animosity between countries.
Fuck it. They’re an intelligence hazard and that’s cheap in government terms.
Yes. In this case I linked it on purpose because of their handlers.
- But it continues the notion that we should rely on them for information, when they have most certainly poisoned Canadian culture and politics.
- Also, by sending users to an American site, it increases their revenues, when this money could have gone to a Canadian media site.
- And if you aren’t already aware, Canadian owned media is deliberately neglected because it’s contrary to a particular elite group in this country… And yeah, we should support and grow Canadian owned media regardless of political party.
But if you still insist on supporting American media…
America is currently at war with us, declared abruptly and out of nowhere. They just decided one day “we want to annex Canada!”
Even if Donald’s presidency is short-lived and a new slightly saner and less stupid administration takes control, I don’t think it’s a good idea to be trusting the Americans any more.
We need to disentangle ourselves from any military dependence on such ridiculously unreliable “allies.” I’m all for this.
Even if Donald’s presidency is short-lived and a new slightly saner and less stupid administration takes control
I know the hamburglar has got his sights on Trump but if he takes his shot during the next 4 years the US gets JD Vance. Vance will be a lot worse than Trump, I do not know how Musk or Teil will handle Vance.
Do you mean Thiel?
Vance may be much smarter than Trump (low bar) and have actual plans for evil, vs. doing awful things on a whim. But, JD Vance doesn’t have Trump’s cult of personality. Whoever comes after Trump will return to the same normal relationship that a president has with their party. With the modern GOP that means intense squabbling and infighting. I doubt a president Vance could get much if his evil plan passed, even if the GOP did still control all the branches of government.
I think everyone is thinking the same way. I think the probability of the US invading is low, but there is a probability.
Even if the US never uses their military against us, there’s a very real chance they withhold parts for military equipment as leverage in a negotiation. They are already withholding military aid from Ukraine as leverage after all. That alone makes it imperative we end Canada’s dependency on the US defense industry.
You would imagine there would be a clause in the contract for exactly this scenario. If there’s not, it’s going to be a common one in contacts going forward…
As an American I sadly agree. This is an overreach that shouldn’t be ignored. And if it is OK now it’s obviously not off the table sometime down the road… this isnt something g you just shove under the carpet.
Doug Ford spent much more on canceling various contracts on a whim. I say bail.
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Notwithstanding clause. Don’t pay a fucking dime.
Besides war declared by US, that makes US permissions on every flight a deal breaker, the plane is a POS, and we should be refunded for returning every existing plane we may already have. Cancelling deal for cause, with zero penalty, despite any contract is the right move.
@avidamoeba cheap. Talk with Europe.
@fletch @avidamoeba
IKR
it’s a geostrategic steal compared to staying entrenched! I hope #auspol is listening.@adamsteer @avidamoeba USA are gone from NATO, stand up, dig in. Is it the easy road? NO! Do you want a future where you steal a toilet for your home town? That’s where you’re headed, Russia
@adamsteer @avidamoeba time to put a proper moat around “EURO interoperability” interoperability with USA is a trap
Yeah Europe should also cancel, the Saabs are excellent while the F35 always has had… issues, and we also got the inferior version too.
@nightwatch_admin you must make it at home, at scale, without reliance on enemies or potential enemies. It’s a reasonably simple matrix to optimise. Eurofighter and Saab, new Euro. Make Australia and Canada and New Zealand and UK demonstrate their commitment to a rules base world.
Avro, 2.0!
I’ve been advocating joining GCAP, an effort by Japan, UK and Italy to make a 6th gen fighter. It isn’t scheduled to deliver the final design until 2035 though, so we would still need a stopgap.
Still, it would send a pretty strong signal and also allow as a path to reinvigorate our domestic aerospace defence industry.
This looks like a good idea. We do have people in Lunenberg, NS that have experience with working with stealth materials which could be a significant contribution to that project.
Could we call it the Arrow? Though I’d also be cool with it being called Spitfire.
I don’t know, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the final platform had room for national partner tweaks. Probably could call ours the Arrow 2: Strange Brew or something.
and also allow as a path to reinvigorate our domestic aerospace defence industry.
Avro Arrow centenary edition in 2059.
We need to pull out of this deal, the last thing Canada needs is to buy weapons from the country that has designs to annex us. And that sells weapons with kill switches.
It doesn’t have a kill switch. It’s a computer program that helps the radar and stuff. Right now everyone’s program goes to the US for QA before they fly with it. It’s purely by agreement, countries are absolutely physically capable of doing this on their own.
Weapons they need permission to use.
Exactly. Absolutely it has to be cancelled based on the fact that the imminent danger to Canada is from the US. No way we should be buying their weapons, listening to their media etc.
The daily unlock code thing is a myth. The grain of truth is that the F-35 relies heavily on mission data files (MDFs), which are region-specific software packages that enable the jet to recognize threats, navigate, and employ weapons, and we depend on the US being willing to supply those updates voluntarily for our fighter jets to be useful.
And Canada is perfectly capable of generating those files themselves.
That feels like an internet rumour. How would that even work? Like if someone took out LM’s servers all F-35s in the world would no longer function? If an enemy jammed the signal they wouldn’t work?
There’s no need to invent problems anyway. The US could potentially cut off Canada from parts needed to maintain the planes and that’s reason enough to cancel it.
It’s not a rumor. I’m sure it’s not quite as simple as the internet is making it out to be, but there are systems that the US hosts which are required for full operation.
That’s an article from 2016.
Oh damn, I didn’t notice. Thanks!
Why even pay the cancelation fee?
It’s not like anything going on now is legitimate.
Exactly. Canada should just choose to ignore it. Just like the US is ignoring international deals they’ve signed with other countries. Thing is: Canada has honour and our actual signature means something when we sign agreements. I don’t think Canada will sink as low as the US.
I do not think so either but we really should.
When the creditor calls tell them Canada doesn’t live here anymore and hang up like your room mate used to do for you in college.
Or promise to pay but never do, like Trump did for his campaign rally expenses.
That’s less than the total incurred costs of Ford’s decision to break the contract with The Beer Store a year earlier than scheduled.
