My current tv is a 42” I got in 2012. I would love to upgrade to a bigger one, but I don’t wanna get a lame smart tv.
I’m on the same boat 44" tv, from ages ago. Connected to my linux reinstalled asus chromebox. Freedom baby yeah!
You can get a smart TV and just not use any of the smart features. My TVs are on a separate VLAN with no internet access, so I can still control them via Home Assistant but they can’t reach out to the outside world. I use Nvidia Shields for streaming.
My next purchase will be a dumb tv with a media stick.
Unfortunately it’s very hard to buy a decent dumb TV these days.
Video projectors are available, though.
yup, this is what I do. costs about as much as a good TV.
They’re all smart too, unless I’m missing something?
not the optoma uhd35, it’s the one I have. 4k60fps or 1080p240fps for when I game.
we have to support the companies that give us what we want, and I voted with my wallet. Im very happy with it
Aorus fo48u here. Dumb as fuck, sometimes too dumb (no remote input processing without hdmi signal), but I’d rather have that than a smart monitor with all the bullshit
Not at all. The better ones are dumb. You have to stay away from cheap chinese drek, of course.
For smart tv, they recommend just never give access to internet. And look if it has some kind of monitor mode so it always launch display on the hdmi port.
They still keep searching for some open wifi to send their stuff through.
This has never been proven in any way. It would be really easy to show that a smart TV will automatically connect to an open WiFi connection and send data, but nobody has done it.
I wonder if a software that just generate gibberish data could be made, just to fuck with them.
Meh, it’s not like the data is monitored by people, it would probably just be like dropping a needle of bad data in a haystack of automated data.
Buy a monitor, not a TV
Lemme just pluck a 52" monitor from the 52" monitor tree where 52" monitors grow bountifully.
Plenty of 48inches though, so compromise
I just checked. In the online stores of the 3 largest tech chains in my country, there’s exactly one 16:9 40+" monitor model available, and that’s a 43" VA panel. The other 40+" stuff are weird absurdly wide curved monitors and some smart whiteboard type thing. So forgive me if I am extremely doubtful of your claim.
I don’t know what to say. I’ve just glanced at the shopping tab right now, and saw plenty of non-curved 48 inches monitor from LG, Samsung and even Dell.
I didn’t check if they were all dumb though, but mine is (Aorus fo48u)
I dumbedcmy smart tv by disconnected it from the internet. The stupid thing is the tv was requesting internet connection to work, so I had to put it on my network and then block everything so the tv pouted and then shut up.
Now I switch to a Fire tv usb stick on it but god I hate it…
the tv was requesting internet connection to work
What tv is that? Just so I know what to avoid
Samsung tv, after a bad update.
While they are at it take a look at car manufacturers too.
To dumb your TV, just don’t connect it to the internet. Get a SFF pc or something and use that to watch your series/movies. My TV functions as a monitor.
If only our fucking government would do something about this and actually regulate these evil bastards.
but then the market would be ever so slightly less free. the horror!
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First you’d need to ban money from politics and change the voting system to better represent the people living there instead of wealthy elites, but that would just be the start.
Whenever wealthy elites have even a tiny bit of power (as they do in any capitalist system, including social democracies like what the Nordic countries have), they will seize as much control as possible. We saw this happen many times.
Nico Semsrott (Kabarettist and member of the EU parliament. Yes, both) proposed in jest sponsoring placement on the jackets of the political members that got donations by companies.
The jackets should then look like the race overalls from Formula 1 or (not US) football players.And I am fully supporting this.
Edit:
Like this:
But their
constituentscorporate donors would not profit as much. Won’t someone think about my profits? 🙃
I just use an Apple TV connected to my TV which isn’t connected to any network. I hook it up every now and again to update the software when there are new features available related to picture/sound.
I also run a Jellyfin server for most of my streaming needs.
Do most smart TVs still allow performing updates via USB? I have an older LG TV which does this.
Apple TV most certainly collects information too…
Wait until they hear about cell phones.
Or the patent with a camera to make sure you’re watching the ad.
Please drink verification can.
Oh god, not again! I’ve already had like 8 Mtn Dews tonight!
Congratulations! You have unlocked… Diabetes.
Can you afford healthcare? (Yes/No)
Mountain Dew ® Dew it right! ™
And cars, and smart thermostats and smart cameras and smart fridges and routers and literally every fucking thing in your house that is connected to the fucking internet. Every single thing in our homes is a data miner.
God damn! You know things are god damn grim when even Oswald Cobblepot has gone woke!
Not mine! But my hobby is making my own smart devices.
There are dozens of us!
Dozens!
(They also last longer than the premade stuff, including the fairly dumb zigbee devices. Though just grabbing some ZigBee sensors is soooo much easier than cleaning up and painting small 3d printed housings…)
They also last longer than the premade stuff,
And they’re a much nicer experience. It’s funny how fast even minimum hardware performs when it’s doing what I ask it to, instead of spying on me.
Soooo much nicer.
Working on tweaking a new launcher for my “Kids Version” htpc, with gcompris, a few shortcuts to some really great non-profits with education games, and of course JF. 4th gen Intel dell micro, runs like a dream…
Also known as “hmm, what else can the ESP32 do?”.
Next stage - “What else can the same ESP32 do?”
How do you learn? I have some ESP32s that I’ve messed around a little bit with, and done some neat stuff…But I don’t have an electronics background at all and I often have trouble even figuring out how to power the damn things safely.
Using homeassistant and esphome is a good starting place unless you want to learn python or C
What if I’m already pretty good at Python and C? :)
Yeah. Samesies. Not all of us put up with this crap.
Edit: There are dozens of us!
this article is a load of bollocks;
i really love my smart idiot box!
but wait, this may sound bad,
we interrupt this limerick for an ad –
have you thought of switching to our socks?
There once was a man who went mad
When YouTube kept forcing an ad
They kept crossing his border,
So he bought this camcorder
Now he’s looping his own tape of a cat.
This is beautiful.
“CTV” is a new term that I wasn’t familiar with.
It’s also slightly confusing because CTV is a major TV station in Canada. I’ve never heard CTV to mean Connected TV.
I’m not even Canadian and the CTV television station is what came to mind. Have also never heard “CTV” to mean connected TV.
What would you guys recommend for a dumb TV with a good quality panel in the 65-75" range that’s a available to buy in the EU? My intention is to hook it up to my own device (probably a mini PC running some Linux distro with Kodi and some other stuff).
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Eizo or iiyama monitors are very good imo. The other use raspberry pi ( or anything else ) + tv card
Thanks. Anything more specific in mind? I know Eizo for their monitors for colour-critical work and from looking on their site I’m only able to find a 50 something inch model that’s probably very expensive (I think it was in their medical lineup). As for iiyama, they have some 65 and 75" models for e-signage, but they’re running Android.
can we just ban online features from tvs, cars, printers, light bulbs etc.
Cars being online has some tangible benefits in that they can transmit location data to emergency services, especially if the driver is unresponsive. Might save someone from dying in a ditch in the middle of nowhere.
Arguably, some of the data collected while driving is also very useful for maintenance and development (e.g. if a lot of vehicles start having a similar issue after X miles).
That said, this data should be limited in scope and use (e.g. must not be sold, especially not to insurance companies), as well as anonymized as much as possible. Which is currently not the case, and that definitely needs regulation.
That said, this data should be limited in scope and use…
Yep, anonymized, limited, non-distributable, and secured, with severe penalties (on the order of tens of thousands of dollars per person, paid to the harmed party) for failure to adhere.
You don’t need a high bandwidth connection to do emergency notifications, and considering it might be in a remote area satellite would be better than LTE.
For the diagnostics you could log events internally and then collect them with OBD-II readers, though I’d like to force car makers to use open data formats so people can see for themselves what’s collected.
That ship, my friend, has already sailed.
Civilians used to own canons. For blowing up ships. And the occasional home invader. Doesn’t matter if it has sailed if we sink it. We should sink that ship.
I blocked my two TVs from phoning home via my pihole. They are the two noisiest devices on my network, by leaps and bounds.
On a day of heavy usage, my phone and desktop may get ~2000 blocked requests combined. That’s high, but not unheard of. It just means I did a lot of browsing, with a lot of blocked ad requests. My TVs average somewhere around 7500 blocked requests per day, on days that I haven’t even turned them on. That’s an attempt to phone home every ~12 seconds. And it is much worse on days that I actually use them.
Jesus dude, what brand TV do you have?
My LG issues a few hundred blocked requests throughout the day with heavy usage. I’ve never seen it wake up and phone home (my Nintendo Switch does it every hour for some stupid reason)
One is a Samsung, and the other is a Roku. The Roku is a little bit noisier, but not by much.
I got a 42" 4k computer monitor instead
How many times the cost of a comparably-sized Trojan TV did that run you?
1.2x
I also use it as a computer monitor though.
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To be clear though, that’s largely because it is just repeating the same request over and over as it times out and retries. They’re a lot less noisy when they actually connect successfully, though it is still undesirable for them to do so.
Is it encrypted?
Maybe i’m stupid, but why would a TV even do that? All it’s know is what you’re watching today, right? How is that information useful? If you’re living with other people, the TV couldn’t even know who’s watching, that would make the data useless.
Knowing the distribution of what entire households watch is very useful. It’s not about spying on you personally.
…seems rather personal to me.
And what other devices are on the network, and what they’re chattering about
It is also about spying on you personally, to build targeted advertising profiles.
Data mining. They know what you watch, when you don’t and any other habits you have.
If you have a microphone on your remote or tv, then they also send that data over.
So this is why my TV walked into the bathroom while I was dropping a deuce. 🤔
pi-hole ftw. the vast majority of my pi-hole’s DNS drops are from various Roku and Roku-like devices. Also, put all your IoT stuff onto a guest network, or if your gear supports it, on its own VLAN.
So lucky my smart thermostat and door/window sensor are connected via DECT-ULE to my router/modem combo (for those interested AVM Fritzbox) and I can poll those via home assistant.
And I don’t think they could phone home (and I hope AVM doesnt do bs).I need to replace my router as it’s coming to end of life. I want one with vlan so I can put all my iot on a separate lan. Any recommendations?
I have the Ubiquiti Edgerouter X. I got it mostly because at the time it was on sale 😂 but it seems to have decent support. Note that you will have to get a wireless AP as the Edgerouter is a pure router without WiFi function. Lots of people also like Mikrotik products.
I’ll check out mikrotik - thanks!
I don’t really understand the rest of what you said haha
Mikrotik are really aimed at advanced users, ubiquiti brand themselves as prosumer products. I found the Ubiquiti interface a complete mess - but it could just be me.
If it can run OpenWRT I’d suggest taking that path (if you like to tinker / the device supports it). My Google WiFi hubs are still humming away after all these years - now with way more features and a usable interface!
I went ubiquity with my entire network. Can recommend
Me too.
I’ll check it out - thanks!
I recently picked up a GL-iNet Flint 2 because it’s a powerhouse and one of the easiest routers to flash Open-WRT onto. If you don’t want to mess with firnware flashing, it comes stock with their fork of Open-WRT. So, either way, you have a ton of control over your router, including setting up VLANs and running AdGuard.
Thank you for the reply - you’ve offered a great opportunity to ask another question 😂
I was looking at adguard. Is this something worth the subscription? I was looking at it because it seems to handle a lot of ads, including those on mobile games and stuff. But in my cursory glance, people are saying it’s not safe…
I’ll look at the GL-iNet because a) I want a powerhouse and b) I want nothing to do with flashing firmware haha
AdGuard as a service is alright, but it’s essentially just a pihole that you don’t have any control over. It does DNS level blocking, which means the ads get blocked before they even load on your network.
The issue is that since you’re routing all of your DNS traffic through AdGuard, you’re directly telling AdGuard which sites you are using. So there are concerns that you are just shifting the data collection from the ad companies to AdGuard instead, but AdGuard has the ability to be way more invasive in how the collect data.
Just set up dual piholes (one for your primary DNS, and one for your secondary DNS) instead. You get the exact same end result, without any of the data collection worry.
Thank you for your detailed responses. Has adguard any track record of collecting data? Is there a way to know?
For consumer grade gear, Ubiquiti is probably the best bet. Unless you want to get into the commercial side of things, but that’s prohibitively expensive for the average person.
Personally I run a GL.iNet system. I like it being completely open source, and the Flint 2 is a workhorse of a router. But as far as ease of use and config, Ubiquiti is certainly more straightforward.
This might be my ignorance, but the Ubiquiti stuff I’m finding seems to be all commercial. I ended up getting a good price on the Flint 2 and it should be here next Friday. I’m hoping to chunk out some time setting it up on the 20th
See, I just don’t connect it to the network. It complained when I set it up but now it just works as a screen.
I’ve got a raspberry pi steaming my desktop to it with gamestream/sunshine/moonlight, and it’s now as smart as my computer. It can even stream from different computers no matter where they are in the house, watch anything with stremio, and play games from them too. It’s way better than using the youtube or netflix button on the TV, most of the services it offers I don’t use anyway.
But actually pihole does sound like a good idea and maybe I should get that set up one of these days.
So with all the recent drama I learned that some TVs look for other open networks or other same brand TVs in range, and if found will join those networks and still share data.
So not connecting it isn’t enough in all cases.
A pihole wouldn’t solve this either if it was smart enough to know it’s blocked and look elsewhere.
can’t you set a password so it can’t join willy nilly?
That would only work until your neighbor leaves their guest WiFi open.
You could set up a dummy LAN with no internet access for the tv. Unless it actually has more than one network card, it would need to be able to have the ability to virtualize network interfaces to connect elsewhere, and I really doubt these TVs are that smart.
Ah, gotcha. That would seem like overkill if that’s what would be needed.
I’d be interested to see more information on that. I don’t doubt companies would do that, but some good information on when it happens and how to prevent it would be useful.
So I did some looking, and as far as I can tell, there’s no definitive proof of someone testing this and reporting on it. It might just be all rumors and speculation.
Thanks, I hope they don’t do it. I would expect the security community to be able to find something like this, since it’s not hard to hook up some devices and do packet sniffing to detect if they’re talking to each other.
This would be an excellent use case for LTT’s faraday cage room for instance.
Gotcha, find its card and rip it out.
In the not so distant future, people will begin turning their houses into faraday cages to ensure nothing can access the outside unless given proper permission.
This is the way.
