Heard this before. Democrats will encounter one tiny setback and give up until the next election cycle.
How out of touch do you need to be to offer something lower than Walmart’s starting wage? And how many times have we heard this lie?
The headline is a little misleading, she said “at least $15” not that she wants it necessarily at exactly $15/hr and no more
Either way it’s still another bullshit lie to lead people to the polls. The day after the election it will never be brought up again
At least it’s a bullshit lie that appeals to the left, I’ve been getting tired of the Democrats’ campaign strategy of “we need to move further right.”
They are saying shit like this because they see they are bleeding the left leaning vote. They will still keep going to the right.
“The left doesn’t like our party.”
“Let’s go more conservative to appeal to voters who are probably ok with voting for the more fascistic candidate.”
“We’re losing support among leftists, better double down on being conservative.”
The Democrats lose the election.
“Why would the Left do this?”
“Clearly we didn’t move far enough to the right. The left are unreliable voters who don’t appreciate everything we do for the right.”
Except Democrats did try to pass $15 after the last election. It didn’t work and a bunch of the worst ones defected, but it wasn’t just quietly forgotten.
They let the unelected parliamentarian say they couldn’t do it. The person that has zero power in congress
Then they had a vote and failed to pass it. But they didn’t just quietly ignore the campaign.
Sanders led the group that called for the vote. As centrists are so delighted to point out when it’s convenient to them, Sanders is not a Democrat.
If it were up to Democrats, they would have thrown up their hands and gleefully announced that there was nothing they could do. Sanders is the reason you can pretend that Democrats don’t hate workers.
Oh please. This started as a simple false statement and now you’re moving the goalposts for them. The Democrats didn’t just propose $15 and “the day after the election it [was] never brought up again”. They tried, maybe they could have tried more, but that they weren’t even close to 50 suggests any path was a failure. They did have 40-something Democrats though, aka the vast majority of the party. That there are shitty Democrats isn’t a revelation.
And this idea that Sanders isn’t a Democrat in any meaningful way is fun trivia, not something a person who is attempting to engage in meaningful conversation about politics takes seriously. He caucuses with them, wins the Democratic primary in his state, competes to lead the party, and supports Democratic nominees even when they’re from the other end of the party. The centrists are disingenuous idiots but so are the leftists who do the exact same thing. Sanders likes the aesthetic of “independent”, good for him, he’s still on team (D) and not remotely the only good senator on it.
You’re about 5 - 10 years behind, maybe longer, Harris.
And they’ll STILL walk it back the moment some unelected clerk with only ceremonial authority objects. If not before THAT even happens.
They always start negotiations at “nowhere near good enough” and make tons of concessions to Republicans from there.
Even the GOP becoming a literal fascist party that never negotiates in good faith hasn’t changed their toxic inadequacy and insistence on bipartisanship being the highest political virtue possible.
Is this an argument as to why we shouldn’t raise the minimum wage?
Daily Telegraph (UK) - News Source Context (Click to view Full Report)
Information for Daily Telegraph (UK):
MBFC: Right - Credibility: Medium - Factual Reporting: Mixed - United Kingdom
Wikipedia about this sourceSearch topics on Ground.News
Wait, doubling it -to- 15 dollars an hour? Holy shit, I knew it was bad, but that is insane. Ours is already starting to feel too low at 17.40 here in Canada, granted that is about the equivalent of around $12.50 USD. So it’s lower than what she is proposing, maybe if she manages it, we’ll be able to get ours up.
The last place I worked upped their minimum wage to $10 an hour. It certainly wasn’t because of benevolence or federal shifts…they slowly realized that when you pay the absolute minimum, you only attract the minimum talent, and most of those positions had very high turnover rates that were costing the company more than it’d be to just raise the starting pay rates.
It was cheaper to pay those positions more money.
Unfortunately in my state where the minimum wage is higher than the federal, many service industry companies refuse to learn that lesson. Or they think 16 cents above minimum wage is enough to attract top tier talent.
Most states have their own minimum wage laws at this point. Not all of them. So this will help a handful of mostly-red states.
It’d only put the US at 5th in the world for minimum wage, which considering the cost of living in the US vs most other countries.
TBF developed countries like Switzerland don’t have a minimum wage law, but have near universal union representation.
It varies by province and at the federal level in Canada, 17.40 is for BC specifically, Alberta and Saskatchewan are the lowest at 15, Nunavut is the highest at 19 and it’s 17.30 for jobs under federal jurisdiction.
Yeah, the states have been moving towards 15, but the national minimum wage has been stuck for a few decades. And also yes, 15 is already way too low.
Even the McDonalds around here know that even the most desperate laugh at 7.25 an hour
Oh.
My minded automatically corrected that as “doubling from 15 to 30”. Because that’s what it needs to be, at least.
What’s the basis for $30/hr? First time seeing that number in the wild.
Y’all really making this Reddit with less content. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I’m seeing 21.50 from articles in 2020 tying min wage to productivity. Maybe that’s the number basis? Or living wage? A living wage per state adjustment for one adult with one child seems to put lw around 30 in a lot of states, with the single adult needing 13-20.
All good possible points, but only one person in this thread can answer what the number basis is, so who knows.
And out comes the abacus.
Insightful
I think the common sentiment is that minimum wage should be rated annually tied to a major factor on how much spending power that money has like inflation or productivity.
Minimum wage started in 1938 at $0.25. if it kept up with inflation today that would be $5.59, which is far from enough to survive with even the most basic rent and groceries.
“”" The dollar had an average inflation rate of 3.68% per year between 1938 and today, producing a cumulative price increase of 2,136.18%.“”"
https://www.in2013dollars.com/us/inflation/1938?amount=0.25
Productivity however has decoupled from wages decades ago, here’s the EPI graph most reference:
If we re-coupled those values for minimum wage today that would be much higher. 3 years ago CBS reported it would be about $26: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/minimum-wage-26-dollars-economy-productivity/
Where did that money go instead of paying fair wages?
Nice breakdown. And I agree that the better solution would be to figure out which metric to tie minimum wage to. I don’t really think throwing out a number every few years like the original reply I was responding to suggested is helpful. But it seems wildly popular here.
Because we’ve been arguing it should be at least 15 for 10 years, and inflation is a bitch and if federal minimum wage had tracked with inflation since it was implemented, it would be closer to 30 bucks an hour than to 15.
And it should be all at once. The instant it’s passed, $30/hr. None of us got eased into it when gas prices and grocery prices and rent and health insurance went up.
I understand your sentiment, but if that’s your policy basis, you’d be asking for $10/hr instead of $15.
Not necessarily a bad idea, I just wanted to know how that number was generated, because without that data, it’s not necessarily a good idea either.
Just read the comments, the data is there.
If you read the comments, it’s actually not. Inflation alone doesn’t account for pinning wages near $30, so that’s not really a good explanation given that it’s nonfactual. Even if he’s considering the living wage instead of historical minimums, $30 is still about 30% higher than what an average living wage would be. Is there some other consideration he has that I’m missing? I wouldn’t know without asking due to an unfortunate lack of psychic powers.
Anyways, sorry I asked for the policy reasoning behind a policy position. It clearly offended many, I realize my mistake, and won’t bring that kind of nonsense around here again.
And note that her wording was “at least $15”, so she’s signaling openness to doing more than that
Good, because “fight for $15” has been going on so long that the real number to regain parity with what minimum wage used to be is a lot higher than that by now.
it’s $22 now
Wow, so you are building up accounts to sell huh?
I saw this EXACT comment on a different post just yesterday from another username.
These account farmers are LAZY!
Are you sure? Becasuse that was probably me on this same account. On a different post on the exact same topic, I made a comment clarifying the same thing
Edit: searching for “at least $15” across lemmy on my instance only has my own comments come up
$15.05 an hour! Increasing at a rate of 11 cents per year from the current minimum of $7.25 Except tipped workers; they still get $2.13.
I’ll believe it when I see it. Seems every candidate has promised this for as long as I’ve been following American politics and no one actually manages it.
They’ll blame someone other than their ineptitude in governing
The more things change, the more they stay the same.
She’s yet to pull out “I will lower taxes!” card that’s been over-promised. “I will lower inflation rates!” card that’s been over-promised.
So many empty promises from any politician that has ever said those.
Vice President Harris and Governor Walz believe that working families deserve a break. That’s why under their plan more than 100 million working and middle-class Americans will get a tax cut.
Dang that is a lot of trackers
Sorry, Google is a real bitch sometimes
Not even mad! Impressed.
And if you read the document associated, its because they are pushing to raise on the $400+k/yr taxes.
Its a bit of an overview of course, but there is meat of course.
Based
$15/hr works out to be about 30k/yr. That’s not enough to live on. We need a $30 minimum wage. It needs to be indexed to both inflation as well as congressional salary. If they get a raise, everyone gets a raise.
Yeah that fight for 15 was in 2016. We are way past that fight needs to be fucking 25 to 30. But watch every single fucking Republican will vote against any increases of minimum wage. 7.25 is a fucking joke and law makers should be fucking ashame of themselves.
Actually any of them vote no on a raise should have all their money seized and made to live on minimum wage for 5 years.
Law makers should be making 7.25 an hour, and only when they are on the floor.
Why not pay everyone fairly instead of incentivizing further corruption through bribery? I’m definitely not going to dispute that they should be paid for the quality and quantity of results generated in terms of legislation…
IMO government work should be volunteer, but you get your clothes, food, and living expenses paid for our of a set budget. You take no salary and accept no bribes, you live in “Government City”. Essentially your finances go null entropy while in office. You do a good job? Public likes you? Private sector likes you? You’re top of the list for top paying jobs when you step down.
But only AFTER you do the good work we need leaders to do for us.
All of the Representative jobs used to be part time. ie People had real jobs that earned their living, and they also did their government work on top of that. And that was when travel took forever.
In other words, one of the primary reasons we are at this point today, is because far too many politicians realized they could simply bilk the State, while doing fuckall for careers spanning 30-40-50 YEARS.
If we take President Biden as an example, the man was elected to the US Senate in 1972! And there are many such examples.
And what’s been the outcome? A better democratic process? No. Higher quality of life for citizens? No. More competitive American goods in the Intl marketplace? No.
So what are we getting for our dollars? And why would we want these fossils (regardless of Party) to remain? They’re clearly not serving American interests.
And while we’re at it, we need to improve and standardize how we measure inflation. Big screen TVs getting cheaper doesn’t matter to most people.
Canadian but same problem here. Long term we need UBI worldwide if we plan on ever moving forward as a species.
Short term we need benefits for those less fortunate keyed to inflation at a bare minimum. In Ontario people with disabilities are paid below the poverty line. It’s disgusting.
I believe all promises that are made within the last 30 days of an election!
Name a more iconic duo than politicians and making promises that rely on the cooperation of other branches of government.
Not voting in enough Democrats into Congress to do anything and saying the Democrats didn’t actually want to do anything
Politicians being bought and sold to the highest bidder of the campaign trail.
Two words: Arms embargo.
Other than that, ask the Cheney’s for some more advise on how to campaign.
Did you post this in the wrong thread, or did lemmy do the thing where you post in one thread and it winds up in another?
And yes, there needs to be an arms embargo. Unless the intended thread was about Ukraine. Ukraine needs the support we’re wasting on Netanyahu.
The Russian trolls seem to be doing overtime now that the election is getting close.
Which one of us are you calling a Russian troll?
The ones who keep trying to shove Israel non sequiturs into every comment section.
So dude posts in the wrong thread and you instantly jump to “must be russian!”
If it was just one guy and not a flood of them across multiple posts and social media, then I’d chalk it up to coincidence.
If it were support for genocide and not opposition to it, you wouldn’t care.
What the fuck is with that horrible picture jesus CHRIST
Good!
Now also link it to yearly inflation annually in December!
The number needs to be set to a good value, but this is the most frustrating aspect of this whole song and dance, because there shouldn’t even be a question about whether it should track inflation. Just setting another flat value so we can watch it atrophy away is maddening. The whole concept is directly related to the cost of goods, and the people needing this wage are the most impacted by price changes. And since it’s supposed to be a floor, you know minimum wage employers aren’t going to voluntarily raise wages to track inflation. They’d be paying even less if they were allowed.
Even if the businesses-first majority of politicians try to low-ball the target, there’s no legitimate argument for not making it auto-update. Businesses just like to reap the extra exploitation between updates.
If the house and Senate approve. She can’t just do it on her own
YES SHE CAN!!
She can do all the things!! More money for me, legal weed,
more money for genocide(wait, she can do that and will…let’s not talk about that one), eat the rich, free abortions, free healthcare!!!She can do it all!! Definitely not items that Congress has to pass! Harris will do it all by her powerful self!!
