How i felt reading that title
Late due to traffic? Who cares? Wanna leave early on a Friday and have overtime? Be my guest!
Flexi time, baby!
As a millennial I’m on team, “Work starts at 9, show up at 9”… but if you’re a little late here and there, whatever. So long as the work gets done.
I would be this way but I started my career in Boston and the T and the busses and the tunnels there make anything close to this impossible. If you actually wanted to be on time you’d be showing up 20 minutes early just as often as 15 minutes late. To truly always be on time would mean planning to get there an hour early every day.
Companies downtown here know just not to put meetings between 9 and 10 because it’s just impossible that every single member of a team will make it to work without issues even once a week. I’d guess even hourly jobs give more flexibility than you’d expect from a standard employer here because it’s just such a clusterfuck to transit in Boston
The further into the burbs you get, the more hardcore companies are about enforcing a 9-5.
I show up 30 minutes early because everyone at my job is incompetent so I have to see how things are going so I can plan my day. Im mid 20’s
I’m paid to solve problems, not warm a chair and let my manager look over my shoulder constantly.
This really depends on what you’re doing.
If you’re in IT nobody should care. If you’re doing an artillery barrage then being late could mean a lot of your people die.
Highly dependent on what you do for work. But if Bob the Bookstore Manager wants me to treat a cashier job with the same respect as a military mission then he better be willing to issue me a rifle and a 400,000 dollar life insurance policy
Depends on the work and if people depend on you being on time. Applying one rule doesn’t really make sense, but neither does RTO or a lot of work culture.
It depends on the job. For most office jobs, I don’t think it matters that much if you show up a bit late to go to the bank or if you’re stuck in traffic, especially now that holding online meetings are easy.
But for a job where being late means holding up the work of hundreds of people, say, being an actor on set, then showing up ahead of time is very important.
When I got my first office job (after working retail and the like), I was uncomfortable when people would have a conversation and not be productive. It was burned into me that one should work at all times while “on the clock.” I learned the phrase, “time to lean is time to clean,” when working at a restaurant.
We really walk on people who work in service jobs. It’s not right.
Why did you have to bring Vin Diesel into this?
I mean, just because you’re on TV and get paid a lot of money doesn’t mean the rules don’t apply to you.
In the US all people are to be treated equally, that’s why large businesses have stringent rules. This is the way to not show favoritism to one person over another. Also why I’ve always worked for small businesses. They aren’t exempt just likely to get in trouble for it
If the company president is late, there is no penalty. Obviously. Of course the rules are inconsistently applied at many companies…
Were you describing your hope?
in the US
All people are to be treated equally
You’re kidding, right?
There is not one grain of truth here its like talking with that guy who sits down to pee and wipes the tip of his Peter with tp because mommy taught him and everyone is too embarrassed to straighten him out.
I was with you at first but you lost me. Why do you care so much about how other people use the bathroom?
The C-suite boss where I work complained about being in the office at 7 am and seeing empty desks.
This was pre-pandemic.
The thing was, policies in place at the time allowed employees to work from home up to two days per week, and flex hours were permitted as long as the core hours of 9am to 3pm were covered. It just sounded insane to everyone.
If you need to be there at a specific time, be professional and be there. If other workers are depending on you to be there, be there. Being tardy just ‘cause, is pretty pathetic. In an ideal world, none of us would have to work. But we do, so show up.
AND if someone is late because of traffic, etc, you shouldn’t sweat it.
I think that depends on the nature of the work, but also whether it’s a regular pattern of being late.
Depends entirely on the job.
If you are interacting with people or have meetings, sure, promptness is important and polite.
If you are doing design work, or coding, or data driven jobs where you don’t really interact with anyone and just work for 8 hours, then who gives a shit if you work from 8-4 or 8:10-4:10? Fuck off if you think that makes a difference. 8 hours is 8 hours. End of story.
Further, if you don’t need 8 hours to finish the work, then nobody should care if you’re there or not, as long as your outcomes are achieved.
Depends a little on the type of work (contract work is different), but generally disagree. Just because you can do the work in less time doesn’t mean everyone can. You can use your spare time to do other things, but if you’re only showing up 20h/week for a full time job, there’s no reason to pay you full time wages.
There’s something off kilter with the labor system when some people are doing the work of several workers while others are doing the work of half.
My last “not odd jobs to make ends meet” job I had was project manager of a job shop. I had days where I was meeting with customers, and days when I was building what my customers asked for.
When I had a customer to meet, I showed up early. I considered it a personal demerit if the customer arrived on site before I did.
When I had a thing to build and the customer wanted it on the 18th I’d turn up when I felt like it. Research, ordering parts, CAD design, programming, coordinating with my team and correspondence could and usually did happen from my house. A lot of brain storming took place in the shower. When it was time to show up in the shop I turned up when I felt like it and left when I felt like it. I cannot think of a time when I missed a deadline that was my fault. The deadline I blew the worst was the one I wasn’t told. “I needed it by the 26th.” “Well the 28th was a great time to tell me that.” “I thought you’d get right on it!” “I had five other customers’ projects going, you were 6th in line.”
I genuinely miss the "Here’s a weird goddamn thing to build. I want a radar guided hammer dulcimer. I need the right handlebar shroud of a 1994 Yamaha FSF-400XF. They only made 400 of these bikes, the part fell off somewhere in Wyoming, here’s the left one. You know that scene in spy movies where they need to steal the diamond launch codes from a room full of laser beams? Make an arcade attraction out of that. I need a 3D scan of my stillborn baby.
Actually no I’m never doing that last one ever again god chestnut-roasting dammit.
And likewise, any employer unexpectedly asking you to stay late is just as unprofessional.
I manage Gen Z, Millenials, Gen X, and Boomers. Yes, all of the above. My experience is that the Gen Z types strive for quality of work and will give you their best once they understand the mission and accept it. The Gen X and Boomers very often get stuck int he performative parts of work: dress, dates and times, etc, and focus less on the quality of work. Millenials are a bit of a mix.
One of my best jobs I was consistently late to, and eventually I asked my manager about it.
She said I was outpacing the other workers in productivity (editing pages of copy) and she wasn’t going to push the matter.
That’s pretty much how I operate. I don’t sweat the high performers but I will hold it against those who don’t perform.
I’m Gen X and the last job I had that required me to work a specific shift was in the kitchen of a pizza place in 1988.
In my first job after college, I asked the business administrator what hours I was expected to work, and she was noticeably confused by the question. She told me most folks show up around 9.l, but made it clear that it was up to me.
In my next job, I asked how to request PTO, and my boss told me he doesn’t care about the record keeping. He said just let him know when I won’t be there, and as long as everything keeps working he doesn’t care if I’m ever there.
Even in my current position when they introduced time clocks and we had to clock in before our start time, we were allowed to specify our start time. I chose 10:00am. I normally get in around 7am, so I figured if I’m not going to be in by 10, I’ll just take the day off.
Sound like you have had some good, human bosses.
A good boss makes the job. A bad boss with a stick up their arse loses good staff.
Damn, what field are you working in that has that much flexibility? That’s pretty unheard of, at least in the US.
My last job for a software company was like this. We had to file for PTO, but we got so much I took nearly every Friday off and didn’t bother looking at my totals.
Prolly High end professional type jobs although those require experience before daddy will permit this level of autonomy
University IT for the first two jobs, now healthcare IT.
University is definitely the place to work if you get into the right department. In my first job I was a db admin for a medical research center. Then I moved to a job as IT support for a robotics lab.
Pay is crap, benefits are fantastic.
The boomers are dying out. It’s a self solving problem.
Millennials are five years away from Get Off My Lawn years old tho.
I’m an elder millennial, a lot fi my friends are sharing very boomer-esque “back when I was a kid, things were better because of XYZ.” Millennials are not the panacea you want them to be. A lot of them are just as dumb as boomers and these problems are systemic, not generational.
I hope when I get to boomer age, I complain about how it used to snow or Roe like I am now. Unless those problems are fixed ofc
Survivorship bias applies to memory as much as anything else.
Not fast enough
They can fuck off with that. Everyone else is there on time because they’re adults, why are you special? All those people left 10 minutes earlier than the absolute minimum of time in order to account for traffic problems, etc. So can you.
I would guess the stats would be the same if you compared boomers at Gen z’s age. I have definitely worked with a lot of always late boomers. The generations aren’t as much of a divide as a timeframe and young people will do as they always have.
I actually think I’m with the boomers on this one. You should strive to be on time. No need to make a federal case out of occasionally being a little late, but it’s wrong to be constantly late.
Why?
Because it often fucks over others who are either overworking themselves pulling your load or can’t take their own break or lunch because you are late
It seems like this is more nuanced than simply black and white. Of all the jobs I’ve worked, about half of them had/have any ramifications for being late.
One job I had, if I wasn’t on time to start the production process, the evening crew would have to stay later to finish. My current job on the other hand is WFH and project-oriented, so as long as I’m not late to a meeting, I could start 2 hours later and finish 2 hours later.
The question is why anyone would answer “why” have they never worked any of the types of job where people depend on each others effort in real time? Like 99.9% of low end jobs are like that.
Chicagodog and a couple of others here have never worked a job that requires even minimal collaboration, at least not in a time sensitive manner. Basic community effort skills would be necessary to get any task accomplished even in a labor-free communist paradise.
No hate to those users either; they are clearly just clueless due to inexperience, and it’s good that there are others to educate them.
Or they can also refuse to take on extra work. Why are we assuming that the amount of work the boss sets is the exact amount that must be done?
In my experience at the lower rungs of retail, the bosses will assign 100% of your non-break time to 80% of the work that needs to be done. I have far more experience with understaffing than busy-work.
Because others have to pick up your slack. Because others have to waste their time waiting around for you. Because it’s unfair to other staff that wind up working longer than you.
Or they could just not either
Not an option if you expect to stay in business.
So it’s up to labor to work extra hard so the boss can own a business? Yikes.
If the labor wants to have a job, yes.
It’s sad that workers can’t even imagine a world where they are in control
It really depends on what you do. If you’re in a factory and the entire line is held up or someone is staying extra time from a previous shift then it’s a big deal. If you’re late to the daily IT stand up meeting you can get the notes from Brad.
Some jobs are more critical than others, sure, but it’s still disrespectful to make people constantly have to cover for you. Why does Brad constantly have to give you notes? What if both Brad and you are late?
If Brad is late then we get to go home, 15 minute rule, just like in school.
No but seriously, Brad is anyone who was there. Someone should be taking notes and sending them in a follow up. Because not everyone is going to be there all the time. Make your systems around people and they’ll work better than just holding everyone up and getting mad.
And if no one is there?
I’m not saying everyone has to get mad over occasional tardiness. But when one employee decides his time is more important than mine because I always have to cover for them, and they are always missing when we start, fuck yes, I will be mad at them, not just as a boss, but as a fellow employee. Have some respect for your fellow workers.
Then you obviously have a structural issue.
And here we have another person assuming being late is a choice. This really is a toxic attitude.
The structural issue is having people constantly late.
And, yes, constantly being late IS A CHOICE. I’m not talking about hitting traffic, the kid or pet being sick, having to deal with an emergency, or stuff like that. I’m talking about people that are repeatedly, constantly, late to everything. People are not just born to perpetually be late.
Work isn’t the only thing going on in their lives. They aren’t robots that you own.
It really depends what you do. If you’re just strolling in to your desk and writing code, wgaf. But fuck anyone that schedules meetings for 8am.
We always scheduled meetings 30 minutes after latest start time which was 9.
As long as you made it to the meeting if it was scheduled and did your full hours, no one cared.
Im always 1 to 2 hours late, sometimes I dont even show up and have a body double go in for me, and I keep getting raises. Don’t worry I give the double a raise too
If I need to be 100% on time, then I’m 100% leaving on time.
Every job I’ve had I’m one of if not the first to stay late. Need me to work a double even if it’s not my job next? Not a problem boss. But be cool with me being 5-10 minutes late. I’ll try to be there on time, but shit happens.
But if your gunna come at me for being a little late, I’ll be damned if I’m gunna stay late to help you. Pick your battles
Exactly. If you’re paying me from 8:00-5:00 I am starting at exactly 8:00. If my computer takes 5 minutes to boot, connect, etc., that starts happening at 8:00. If you want me online and responsive at 8:00, then you have to pay me for the boot time before 8:00. No pay, no work.
Worked retail and the end of shift crew always had to wait to leave at the same time with some bag check BS. Pile of shit thieving corporate and management would adjust the time to cut out payment of the last 5 or so minutes. The company is now defunct (taken out by vulture investment group owner entity after it was sold), otherwise it would have been nice to call the department of whatever deals with wage theft on them now that I know better. A.k.a.: if your company does time adjustments silently, consider this your signal and call the inspectors on them.
I wasn’t arguing any different. By all means leave on time.
But this is part of why it is disrespectful. Look at nurses. If you are late, patients in a hospital can’t just go without care. So that means the prior shift is asked to stay later. That’s just one example.
I was solving a DNS issue that I resolved at 5.12 yesterday. If I had knocked off on time the website would still be down until January 2nd.
For the want of a nail…
So, you should get overtime.
I mean for that I’d have to be hourly, I’m salaried, which often works in my favor tbh. If I charged my hourly rate they’d find ways to nickle and dime me and be watching my productivity much more closely.
I get where you’re coming from. It is nice to your fellow employees to be on time to relieve them. That’s just being a solid team player.
But again, every team or job I’ve had understands if I’m a little late cause they know I’m putting in the work when I get there. Shit, after I got into a motorcycle accident and was bleeding down my side I still had the driver take me to work to talk to my boss. Stayed until the concussion made me leave haha. My boss at the time would tell that story to people who were a bit sluggish. Saying how even on the worst days there’s no reason to not give it your all since YourPartnerInCrime came in half dead.
In hindsight it was a bit dumb. But, don’t complain about me being 5 to 10 minutes late. I’ll be there and I’ll give it all.
I understand if it’s occasional. But constantly means you are not giving it all. Sorry, I just hate lateness. I am almost never late, but am constantly waiting on people that cannot meet at an agreed upon time. It just wastes my time and shows me they think their time is more important than mine. It’s a pet peeve.
I’m all for flexibility and flextime when it can be granted. But if you agree something happens at a certain time, it should happen at that time.
Depends on the job
